Amen George.
People I am a capitalist also. This is a loan. This can work if they do it right.
MICHIGAN will be gone for 50 years if this does not happen.
And those of you that think it will not touch you are nuts. This will touch everything in this country.
I will be fucked if this doesn't go. This will touch everyone in this country. How would you guys like 8 million people moving into other areas and competing for jobs with you.
RS, I respectfully disagree.
We are not talking about throwing the entire industry "under the bus" here. We are talking about failed companies that have shown little if any competitive hutzpah and have been building inferior products for years and in doing so, ripping off consumers who don't realize it until they finally do. That is the reason why they are failing. The don't deliver a good product like they once did and the Japs have whupped their asses in many ways. Efficiency and quality are two that come to mind right away.
Remember when buying something Japanese equated to something cheap and poorly made? The sad fact of the matter is that the tables are now turned. Detroit has been living on its reputation and the American flag and it's more and more looking like a facade because it is. That's why their customers are fleeing to foreign imports and foreign cars manufactured here.
The blue book value of most American cars, after a few years PALES by comparison to many imports. A lot of people realize that and are tired of paying through the nose for parts and service when their ride quits on them. Count me in.
In the last 5 years, I have bought several cars. One Jeep, three Toyotas and one Chevy Blazer. The Jeep seems to be holding up pretty well. That's my daugher's car. The Toyotas are solid as a rock and the Blazer (for the now estranged girlfriend) is a lemon. It even feels cheap and unstable to drive by comparison -- like a popcorn machine inside a tin can. And it wasn't a cheap model of the Blazer either.
If there was no bail out, the courts move in.. last case scenario. Otherwise, the assets are bought up by someone who will not trash the assets as if they didn't exist. I don't think they will just go away, they will reemerge as something different. Perhaps Audi's or Hondas etc. Yes there would be considerable downsizing but untimately the plants and marketing segments of the failed companies will just morph into something else and hopefully the managment and ownership will be competent and build an American car with some pride and dependability, and something that will hold its value like both of my Toyotas, compared to the Jeep (to a point) and the Blazer.
I used to own a Toyota Tacoma, small pickup that I paid about $11,500 new for about 4 or 5 years ago. When I traded it up for a bigger and better Tundra, I was actually given $13,000 in trade in value for it. Its value actually went up in approx 1 year!
Meanwhile my lemon Blazer has been in and out of the shop 4 times for the same issue, something related to a computer problem that none of their technicians can understand. It tends to konk out if there's less than 1/2 a tank of gas and I'm doing over 50... as if someone pulled the plug and just switched it off. Then after about 15 seconds, rolling down the freeway in neutral, I can restart it hopefully before I have to pull over and stop completely on the side of the road. I'm about to take it in for the same problem for the 4th time.
Furthermore, it's blue book value has dropped by almost 2/3 since I bought it. Compare that to my 2 Toyotas that have lost a little more than 1/3 of their blue book value over the same period of time.
I haven't had problems with the Jeep (liberty) but it's value has declined a little more than the Toyotas but not as much as the Blazer. The Jeep isn't so bad but it could be better.
That sums it up to me. Cheaply made and expensive to buy and own. No wonder Detroit has gone down hill. I don't blame consumers for wanting something more for their money. Meanwhile the big 3 have been sucking people's money and giving them less for too many years.
That is what is at the heart of the problem, not to mention inefficiently run production by comparison and humongous union benefits and labor costs that have driven them to produce crappy cheap cars while overcharging people for the value they provide.
It's gotta go. I don't think I will get my wish but what's worse, I don't think consumers will either, not under current arrangements between corporate management, their business policies and the unions who have basked in the glory days of Detroit for too long.
Simply this... I prefer to own a car that can run for 100's of thousands of miles without needing any major repairs and will also hold its resale value for a long time. That's why I choose to buy a Toyota instead of another bucket of bolts like my Chevy Blazer. My problems and my needs are typical.
Furthermore, I am not interested in providing some kind of expensive form of "welfare" donated to the union workers whether their employers stay in business or not and whether I like what they make or not. It's a no-win situation all around. To prolong that condition is what our government would be doing should there be a bail out... which is what will probably happen.
American consumers and taxpayers will be continue to be the ultimate losers. I just think it's high time that we get this place ship shape and running right including the auto industry. Clearly the present powers at be cannot handle it. It is wrong for our government to legislate the perpetuation of legal rip offs of unwary consumers. That's an understatement if there ever was one. You can't legislate well made produts and well run companies but the forces of capitalism can and that would fix the problem. A bailout would only perpetuate more of the same and fix nothing.
