Why Aren't We Pointing Any Fingers At The Medical Field?!? ?

[CHOPTALK]

Hache you live in Florida you should know this .
There have been many times during hurricane evacs where yes indeed McDonald’s runs out of hamburgers and Popeyes runs out of chicken , the gas stations run out of gas etc..

You just can’t stash 200,000 ventilators that you need an average of once every 100 years .
You can’t build 2000 extra icu rooms at every hospital it’s impossible .

And ventilators just so happens to be what we need for this pandemic .

What about the next one ?

The next one could be completely different then this and you might need a completely different set of medical equipment .
Are we going to buy hundreds of billions of every form of every potential medicL equipment that could treat every potential thing that could possibly come along ?

And what about people ?

Did you go to medical school ? And if not why not ?


They also have a lack of people .

Is it peoples fault for going to law school or business school instead of medical school?

 

[HacheMan]

It is a terrible analogy because unlike medical equipment food spoils. Not only would you need to purchase extra freezers to store those extra beef patties but buns, lettuce, tomatoes, onions etc spoil and would need to be thrown out and purchased every day.

How long do you think a restaurant can stay open wasting thousands of dollars each day in the hopes that a pandemic might come? Not very long.

Are you kidding me??

It has absolutely NOTHING to do with comparing food to medical supplies.

It's about entities not having something on hand/in stock that should be a no-brainer, because of poor management.

 

[Chi_Archie]

Leaders and those that follow great leadership do not point fingers in times of trouble

roll up you sleeves and get to work, or get out of the way.

 

[HacheMan]

And what about people ?

Did you go to medical school ? And if not why not ?


They also have a lack of people .

Is it peoples fault for going to law school or business school instead of medical school?

I don't understand this part of the question

 

[CHOPTALK]

I don't understand this part of the question

It’s very simple .
We could have billion ventilators but if you don’t hAve the properly trained people to operate them they are useless.

You can’t hire people off the street to run these things . It requires professionally trained people to operate them.

 

[CoffeeStation]

Leaders and those that follow great leadership do not point fingers in times of trouble

roll up you sleeves and get to work, or get out of the way.

+1

 

[Chi_Archie]

It’s very simple .
We could have billion ventilators but if you don’t hAve the properly trained people to operate them they are useless.

You can’t hire people off the street to run these things . It requires professionally trained people to operate them.

good point

here are the soldiers that people want to let sink or swim. good luck to rural areas and small towns attracting new physicians after we lose a few %'s of these already low numbers. I'd hate to be old and live in the sticks for the next few decade. All the new grads, foreign docs ect will want to go where the resources are. ie metropolition areas.

The Association of American Medical Colleges has released dire projections for the state of healthcare in America in the coming years. The projections say “the U.S. will see a shortage of 46,900 to 121,900 physicians by 2032 in primary and specialty care.”

2016 United States Physicians

953,695

Under 30- 16,519 1.9%
30-39 -184,120 21.7%
40-49 -214,595 25.2%
50-59 -215,541 22.5%
60-69 -138,815 16.3%
70+ -75,627 8.9%

 

[CoffeeStation]

I think what some seem to be missing are hospitals are suppose to make money, like any other business, and if hospitals are losing money they can be shut down like any other business

 

[HacheMan]

It’s very simple .
We could have billion ventilators but if you don’t hAve the properly trained people to operate them they are useless.

You can’t hire people off the street to run these things . It requires professionally trained people to operate them.

Well we both know they have millions more nurses and specialists than they do ventilators.

And I understand they can't stock massive amounts but there clearly should be more.

And the need and relevance of this equipment in general likely won't change.

Pretty sure we won't be needing any extra radiation or brain surgery equipment with threats like this going forward.

 

[Chi_Archie]

https://www.statnews.com/2019/07/25/rural-health-crisis-physicians/


https://www.npr.org/sections/health...rs-in-rural-areas-means-patients-go-without-c

https://www.foxnews.com/politics/americas-rural-hospital-crisis-becomes-major-2020-campaign-issue

MELCHER-DALLAS, Iowa – When Spenser Miller lost a finger in a work accident at 21 years old, he was driven 10 minutes away to a local hospital where he was treated for three hours before being transported to a nearby specialist in Omaha, Neb., for surgery to reattach his finger.
A year later, he opted to have the finger removed after physical therapy wasn’t improving his muscle control, but he remains grateful to this day for that local hospital and its initial care.
WARREN IN POLLING SLIDE AMID MEDICARE-FOR-ALL PLAN CRITICISM
“That local hospital was instrumental in being able to save my finger originally … because they said the only thing that saved my finger was them being able to get that finger on ice right away,” he said. “If I wouldn't have had that local hospital, I mean, I don't know what would have happened then. Thank God we had that local hospital.”
But times have changed since Miller's accident a decade ago, with rural hospitals now shuttering at a rapid clip. Since 2010, more than 100 rural hospitals have closed, with another 430 at risk of shutting their doors, according to the National Bureau of Economic Research. This poses a huge challenge -- and danger -- for the 20 percent of the population living in rural America.
As the crisis worsens, it has started to generate increased attention on the campaign trail. Presidential candidates are now talking about the rural hospital shortage on a regular basis, unlike past cycles, as they court voters in critical states like Iowa where the thinning medical infrastructure is an everyday reality.

 

[Chi_Archie]

I think what some seem to be missing are hospitals are suppose to make money, like any other business, and if hospitals are losing money they can be shut down like any other business

yes thousands of hospitals will close in the years following this. People will start having to drive 60 mins to an ER

 

[mango]

Are you kidding me??

It has absolutely NOTHING to do with comparing food to medical supplies.

It's about entities not having something on hand/in stock that should be a no-brainer, because of poor management.

Medical equipment can be stored and used years down the road. Food spoil in one day! It was a terrible analogy so I don't know why you keep defending it.

You call it poor management, while businessmen call it staying profitable to avoid bankruptcy.

 

[CoffeeStation]

yes thousands of hospitals will close in the years following this. People will start having to drive 60 mins to an ER

Where are u getting that from? Haha

 

[CHOPTALK]

Medical equipment can be stored and used years down the road. Food spoil in one day! It was a terrible analogy so I don't know why you keep defending it.

You call it poor management, while businessmen call it staying profitable to avoid bankruptcy.

And besides that restaurants run out of food all the time during emergencies .

Heck is Walmart poorly run because I can’t get a roll of fricken toilet paper ?

 

[CoffeeStation]

Omg...he might have made a bad analogy. Let's stop harping on the food thing. With all due respect to all.

 

[HacheMan]

Medical equipment can be stored and used years down the road. Food spoil in one day! It was a terrible analogy so I don't know why you keep defending it.

You call it poor management, while businessmen call it staying profitable to avoid bankruptcy.

I could use dozens of analogies.

A ship called the Titanic with thousands of passengers, yet only enough lifeboats to save 1/3 of them.

A hospital who knew one day something bad would happen, and even practices for such events, has 20 ppl dying, and only 5 fucking ventilators to save that many.

Same analogy - idiots running the show

You guys are letting them off the hook too easily.

 

[Chi_Archie]

here is some info from before this crisis.... do you think following it, that health care will cost the same? will people be able to afford to pay the same out of pocket?


https://www.ruralhealthweb.org/news/nearly-700-rural-hospitals-at-risk-of-closing


https://www.ruralhealthweb.org/NRHA...Fs/02-02-16PI16NRHAreleaseoniVantagestudy.pdf


For immediate release Contact: Lindsey CoreyFeb. 2, 2016 corey@NRHArural.orgNew report indicates 1 in 3 rural hospitals at riskNew research indicates that sustained Medicare cuts threaten the financial viability of more than one-third of ruralhospitals in America. As rural hospital closures continue to escalate, the National Rural Health Association calls onCongress to act swiftly.According to data released today by iVantage Analytics, the rural hospital closure crisis has significantly worsened.The report, “2016 Rural Relevance: Vulnerability to Value Study,” indicates 673 rural hospitals are at risk of closure,which means 11.7 million patients would lose much-needed health care access. And 210 of these hospitals are at an“extreme risk” of closure.Since 2010, 66 rural hospitals have closed. The closure rate is increasing. It was six times higher in 2015 than in 2010.“Closures of this magnitude would mean millions of rural patients across the country will lose access to their closestemergency room, and rural economies will suffer a devastating blow,” said Alan Morgan, CEO of the National RuralHealth Association.A rural hospital is often a top employer in rural communities, and can mean as much as 20 percent of the local ruraleconomy. According to iVantage, if 673 additional hospitals were forced to shut their doors, 99,000 direct health carejobs and another 137,000 community jobs will be lost. Over 10 years, rural communities will lose $277 billion in GDP.The annual report examines multiple economic metrics for rural hospitals across the nation.“Our 2016 analysis suggests that the situation is worsening for many rural communities,” said Michael Topchik,iVantage senior vice president. “Each year, our study’s methodology is rigorously reviewed to ensure this benchmarkreport reflects the impact of many pressure points converging on rural health care.”When rural hospitals close, physicians, physician assistants, nurses and other health care providers often leave thecommunity. Medical deserts are forming across the nation, significantly adding to the health care workforce shortagein rural communities. Seventy-seven percent of rural U.S. counties are already considered Primary Care HealthProfessional Shortage Areas. Rural hospital closures are on the rise in large part due to continuing Medicare cuts.“Bad-debt reductions, sequestration cuts and other cumulative Medicare cuts hurt rural hospitals disproportionatelyhard because per capita rural America is older, poorer and sicker than their urban counterparts,” said Morgan.NRHA calls on Congress to enact H.R. 3225, the Save Rural Hospitals Act. This legislation, introduced by Reps. SamGraves (R-Mo.) and Dave Loebsack (D-Iowa), will stop the flood of rural hospital closures and strengthen the ruralhealth delivery system by eliminating numerous cuts in Medicare to rural hospitals. Additionally, the bill creates aninnovative, sustainable delivery model for the future of rural health care.NRHA is a nonprofit organization working to improve the health and wellbeing of rural Americans and providingleadership on rural health issues through advocacy, communications, education and research. NRHA’s membership ismade up of more than 21,000 diverse individuals and organizations, all of whom share the common bond of an interestin rural health.RuralHealthWeb.org

 

[CoffeeStation]

I could use dozens of analogies.

A ship called the Titanic with thousands of passengers, yet only enough lifeboats to save 1/3 of them.

A hospital who knew one day something bad would happen, and even practices for such events, has 20 ppl dying, and only 5 fucking ventilators to save that many.

You guys are letting them off the hook too easily.

Hache,

There aren't even enough ventilators in existence or companies to build them. That's why u are seeing many companies that are completely overhauling their factories in an effort to produce them...

For the titanic obviously there were life boats and they simply didn't want them because of cosmetic purposes. Had nothing to do with supply or cost.

 

[Chi_Archie]

[FONT=&quot][h=1]1 In 4 Rural Hospitals Are At Risk Of Closure And The Problem Is Getting Worse[/h]
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Healthcare



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<figure class="embed-base image-embed embed-0" role="presentation" style="box-sizing: border-box; margin: 0px; clear: both;">

<figcaption style="box-sizing: border-box; color: rgb(115, 115, 115); font-family: "Work Sans", sans-serif; font-size: 0.75rem; line-height: 1.67; margin-top: 0.5em;"><fbs-accordion class="expandable" current="-1" style="box-sizing: border-box; display: inline;">Activists attend a rally for rural hospitals on Capitol Hill June 15, 2015 in Washington, DC. AFP ... [+]
</fbs-accordion><small style="box-sizing: border-box; font-size: 9px; line-height: 2; text-transform: uppercase;">AFP VIA GETTY IMAGES</small></figcaption></figure>As of January 1, 2020, the rural hospital closure crisis has claimed 120 facilities across the nation over the past 10 years according to a recent study released by the Chartis Center for Rural Health. The rural hospital closures were tracked by the Cecil G. Sheps Center for Health Services Research at the University of North Carolina. The study found a sharp uptick in recent years in the number of rural hospital closures from 2017 (when rural hospital closures slowed somewhat to 10 total hospitals closing that year), to 2019, which proved to be the worst year for rural hospital closures, finding 19 hospitals closing their doors that year. With 60 million Americans living in rural communities (roughly 19.3% of the population) and access to healthcare in these regions already being a daily struggle, the study sheds light on an issue that requires rapid attention by policy makers, as well as local and state governments.
<figure class="embed-base image-embed embed-1" role="presentation" style="box-sizing: border-box; margin: 0px; clear: both;">

<figcaption style="box-sizing: border-box; color: rgb(115, 115, 115); font-family: "Work Sans", sans-serif; font-size: 0.75rem; line-height: 1.67; margin-top: 0.5em;"><fbs-accordion style="box-sizing: border-box; display: inline;">With 19 closures, 2019 was the single worst year of the rural hospital closure crisis.
</fbs-accordion><small style="box-sizing: border-box; font-size: 9px; line-height: 2; text-transform: uppercase;">CCRH VULNERABILITY RESEARCH</small></figcaption></figure>Across the US there are currently 1,844 rural hospitals, so the closure of 120 of them over 10 years (about 7%) is a substantial hit to the rural healthcare system, especially when the regions with the highest number of rural hospital closures are some of the nation’s poorest and most vulnerable. According to the study, States in the Southeast and lower Great Plains (Midwest) bore the greatest brunt of the closure crisis with the highest number of rural hospital closures since 2010 being in; Texas (20), Tennessee (12), Oklahoma (7), Georgia (7), Alabama (6) and Missouri (6). Unfortunately, the trend for these regions does not seem to be abating. The study found that today, “453 rural hospitals (i.e. Critical Access Hospitals and Rural & Community Hospitals) are vulnerable to closure based on performance levels which are similar to rural hospitals at the time of their closure.” And they are all similarly in the Southeast and Iower Great Plains Region.

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[HacheMan]

Regarding the post above
..

Somebody is lying.

Either insurance companies or hospitals because one of them is getting all of our money