I agree with you Coach. If I were in charge on that boat there is no way in hell I would have put my hands up to the dirty, disgusting Iranians. Let alone apologize on camera.
There really is 2 Americas. The makers and the takers. Most, if not all, of these people not only never served, they don't know anyone who has. So this is all just some big cathartic exercise done in part to mitigate the fact that they would never pick up a weapon and fight if needed.
Press secretary Josh Earnest said there's also not "any reason for anybody to be embarrassed" about photos and video Iran released showing the sailors on their knees with their hands above their heads, or their lieutenant apologizing.
My goodness.
As I've said before, for Democrats, the military is just for parades and chauffeuring around political officials.
My goodness.
As I've said before, for Democrats, the military is just for parades and chauffeuring around political officials.
Acebb;11439481[SIZE=5 said:][/SIZE]Press secretary Josh Earnest said there's also not "any reason for anybody to be embarrassed" about photos and video Iran released showing the sailors on their knees with their hands above their heads, or their lieutenant apologizing.
My goodness.
As I've said before, for Democrats, the military is just for parades and chauffeuring around political officials.
:monsters-
Coach, I think you and I have already agreed to disagree on this but I would like to give the devil his due. Snowden exposed illegal and anti-Constitutional intelligence gathering. The US is a nation of laws. We shouldn't applaud when people go outside the Constitution to gain information. The ends don't always justify the means.
Will this lead to American deaths in the future? Probably. But we can't use that as an excuse to break the law.
Did the US Military Code Of Conduct change since I left a few years back?..... I remember having to recite these in basic training, and whenever I went before any NCO Boards before my promotions.
I am an American, fighting in the forces which guard my country and our way of life. I am prepared to give my life in their defense.
I will never surrender of my own free will. If in command, I will never surrender the members of my command while they still have the means to resist.
If I am captured, I will continue to resist by all means available. I will make every effort to escape and aid others to escape. I will accept neither parole nor special favors from the enemy.
If I become a prisoner of war, I will keep faith in my fellow prisoners. I will give no information or take part in any action which might be harmful to my comrades. If I am senior, I will take command. If not, I will obey the lawful orders of those appointed over me and back them up in every way.
When questioned, should I become a prisoner of war, I am required to give name, rank, service number, and date of birth. I will evade answering further questions to the utmost of my ability. I will make no oral or written statements disloyal to my country and its allies or harmful to their cause.
I will never forget that I am an American, fighting for freedom, responsible for my actions, and dedicated to the principles which made my country free. I will trust in my God and the United States of America.
I am an American, fighting in the forces which guard my country and our way of life. I am prepared to give my life in their defense.
I will never surrender of my own free will. If in command, I will never surrender the members of my command while they still have the means to resist.
If I am captured, I will continue to resist by all means available. I will make every effort to escape and aid others to escape. I will accept neither parole nor special favors from the enemy.
If I become a prisoner of war, I will keep faith in my fellow prisoners. I will give no information or take part in any action which might be harmful to my comrades. If I am senior, I will take command. If not, I will obey the lawful orders of those appointed over me and back them up in every way.
When questioned, should I become a prisoner of war, I am required to give name, rank, service number, and date of birth. I will evade answering further questions to the utmost of my ability. I will make no oral or written statements disloyal to my country and its allies or harmful to their cause.
I will never forget that I am an American, fighting for freedom, responsible for my actions, and dedicated to the principles which made my country free. I will trust in my God and the United States of America.
Press secretary Josh Earnest said there's also not "any reason for anybody to be embarrassed" about photos and video Iran released showing the sailors on their knees with their hands above their heads, or their lieutenant apologizing.
My goodness.
As I've said before, for Democrats, the military is just for parades and chauffeuring around political officials.
They just followed the "protocol" okay.
There have been many people who have broken the law and risked lives. Hell, our entire American Revolution was a good example of this as well as the Civil Rights Movement.
I can understand why you're pro-government on this matter because you work for the government but you're one of the good guys. There are some evil sociopaths in the government that are putting the country's security at risk by the tactics they use against unfriendly governments and even friendly governments. They need to be exposed to prevent further damage.
Please don't make this about Obama, how ridiculous. You think enemies of the USA really give a damn about who the president is? I'd be willing to bet that most of them don't know or care. However I can see them hating Obama moreso because he has that name and he will not stand with them. Insolence! Infidel! They see the red white and blue and hate all that are associated with it. Let us not rush to judgement here. I totally get the NRSS# thing but come on now, let's wait til we get a little more to run with. If there was a known chance of their getting caught ahead of time, were there orders issued on how to act in case they wre captured? We might only know 5% of the story here. I remember the pilots in my Company saying "Fuck them" when we were discussing matters of crossing intl borders on a particular flight hauling nuc warheads.
I agree w/ you that the terrorists really don't care who our President is. 9/11 happened under Bush but had been planned well before he ever took office. However, you say "don't make this about Obama". I have to disagree. This incident (what this thread is about) happened w/ the Iranian government (their military), not some non-state such as ISIL or Taliban. This incident occurred just before the "Iran Deal" was to be implemented. I can assure you if our President was someone who has flexed our muscles, such as Reagan or Bush, the Iranian's would have handled this incident differently and our response would have been completely different. That is my opinion, of course. But the perception around the world is that the US has smaller balls than it used to. So, this incident may not be "about Obama", but it was very likely "about Obama" because Iran knew if could get away with it.
Coach, to be honest I really don't think anything different occurs if say Mitt won the nod way back when. And I don't know how much mud is on Hilary (not a fan fwiw)in all of this either. One of those things where we may never know the real truth but I will most def check ouit that Michael Bay movie that just came out, hopefully it offers a little more insight. I did see the troops involoved interviewed recently and there was one guy that I bought into over the others. We'll see.
Even if they do view Obama as a weaker sort, and on some levels I get this, surely the ones in tbhe know understand that militaryu decisions go thru the JointChiefs and the Prez acts off their advice. They are smart enough to know that US military vs. Iran, Iraq, Syria et al wiould not be a contest. Okay this is takein g me 10 min to type...I have a splint on my right index finger...nast razor cut a few hours ago - respect your take in all of this but I am wary of those who hate on Obama no matter what. Too many cannot view him on even keel. They hate him first amd foremost and then spin it accordingly. Not accusing you of this btw. Just in general I see too much of this day to day.
Even if they do view Obama as a weaker sort, and on some levels I get this, surely the ones in tbhe know understand that militaryu decisions go thru the JointChiefs and the Prez acts off their advice. They are smart enough to know that US military vs. Iran, Iraq, Syria et al wiould not be a contest. Okay this is takein g me 10 min to type...I have a splint on my right index finger...nast razor cut a few hours ago - respect your take in all of this but I am wary of those who hate on Obama no matter what. Too many cannot view him on even keel. They hate him first amd foremost and then spin it accordingly. Not accusing you of this btw. Just in general I see too much of this day to day.
I can't vouch for the validity of this web site but it looks like you and I were on to something:
http://www.americanthinker.com/blog...iranian_capture_of_two_us_riverine_boats.html
Flash! A former Navy SEAL, Matt Bracken, just blew up what I have been calling "a pack of lies from the US and Iran" on what the hell happened that got our boats captured and taken to the Farsi Islands.
Remember: the single most dangerous area in all the Persian Gulf is a small group of Island in almost the middle of the heavily travelled shipping lanes that is a major naval base for Iran and the HQ of the radical IRG for special operations of their own against all the countries abutting the Gulf. A top Marine told me our two boats were special ops boats with crews that delivered our own SEALS... the direct rivals of the IRG on Farsi.
The idea that toxic area would be a possible rendezvous site area for a refueling is idiotic... as is the idea of commo and navigation failure. You might as reasonably expect Gibraltar to be a rendezvous point for resupply for the Nazi subs in Das Boot.
If the US press today weren't evenly split between toadys and military incoherents, they should have seen what has been clear to anyone who has any military experience.
Here is Matt Bracken's stunning take:
I rarely pull out my dusty old trident, but in this case, here goes. I was a Navy SEAL officer in the 1980s, and this kind of operation (transiting small boats in foreign waters) was our bread and butter. Today, these boats both not only had radar, but multiple GPS devices, including chart plotters that place your boat's icon right on the chart. The claim by Iran that the USN boats "strayed into Iranian waters" is complete bull$#it. For an open-water transit between nations, the course is studied and planned in advance by the leaders of the Riverine Squadron, with specific attention given to staying wide and clear of any hostile nation's claimed territorial waters. The boats are given a complete mechanical check before departure, and they have sufficient fuel to accomplish their mission plus extra. If, for some unexplainable and rare circumstance one boat broke down, the other would tow it, that's why two boats go on these trips and not one! It's called "self-rescue" and it's SOP.
This entire situation is in my area of expertise. I can state with complete confidence that both Iran and our own State Department are lying. The boats did not enter Iranian waters. They were overtaken in international waters by Iranian patrol boats that were so superior in both speed and firepower that it became a "hands up!" situation, with automatic cannons in the 40mm to 76mm range pointed at them point-blank. Surrender, hands up, or be blown out of the water. I assume that the Iranians had an English speaker on a loudspeaker to make the demand. This takedown was no accident or coincidence, it was a planned slap across America's face.
Just watch. The released sailors will be ordered not to say a word about the incident, and the Iranians will have taken every GPS device, chart-plotter etc off the boats, so that we will not be able to prove where our boats were taken.
The "strayed into Iranian waters" story being put out by Iran and our groveling and appeasing State Dept. is utter and complete BS from one end to the other.
This entire situation is in my area of expertise. I can state with complete confidence that both Iran and our own State Department are lying. The boats did not enter Iranian waters. They were overtaken in international waters by Iranian patrol boats that were so superior in both speed and firepower that it became a "hands up!" situation, with automatic cannons in the 40mm to 76mm range pointed at them point-blank. Surrender, hands up, or be blown out of the water. I assume that the Iranians had an English speaker on a loudspeaker to make the demand. This takedown was no accident or coincidence, it was a planned slap across America's face.
Just watch. The released sailors will be ordered not to say a word about the incident, and the Iranians will have taken every GPS device, chart-plotter etc off the boats, so that we will not be able to prove where our boats were taken.
The "strayed into Iranian waters" story being put out by Iran and our groveling and appeasing State Dept. is utter and complete BS from one end to the other.
Do you think that any other president would have been 100% honest with the American public on a similar matter? They don't do that. You think Reagan was always honest with his adoring public? HAH!!! The Seals/Delta Force types don't even give consistent accounts of missions they have been on. BTW, I don't know that I want the CINC telling the citizenry every little thing, esp when it comes to military matters and special ops type missions.
Why do you blatantly LIE? You're usually better than that. You don't want to be in the place that the sick people in Poli are at. I blast Obama plenty, and you know this, but unlike the low information hacks, who blame him for a cloudy day or their burnt toast, I also praise him when he deserves praise, and his diplomatic successes with Iran deserve praise.
