Question for the religious: If God knows best and is infallible why bother praying?

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Why bother praying?

  • It makes me feel better

    Votes: 3 20.0%
  • I know better than God

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • I'm a petty POS

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • I want nice things

    Votes: 4 26.7%
  • I dont bother

    Votes: 8 53.3%

  • Total voters
    15

Oh boy!
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I understand about people wanting to talk to God and they feel better about it. But I don't believe God does things only because we ask Him to. If God does things only because we ask him to then if we didn't ask him he wouldn't have done it. I refuse to believe in a God that withholds mercy because someone doesn't ask for it. If he is all-powerful and all good the he will always do the right thing without us asking for it.
 
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Understandable, and I'd never truly fault anyone for hoping that someone they love gets better but my point is that if God is infallible why waste time bringing his attention to something he obviously is already aware of and may be part of a much bigger picture that our tiny human minds couldnt possibly comprehend. Plus Jesus basically was basically God and had the power to heal people, we don't have that power and again God knows what he is doing, who am I or you to try to convince him otherwise?


Words, if they have the power of God behind them, can unleash the creative & healing powers of the Lord.

That's how the human Lord Jesus healed people. Not by merely thinking it, ever.

That's how God created the universe. Not by twinkling his nose, as in a TV witch series & movie, Bewitched.

God SAID let there be light. And there was light. (Genesis chapter 1, the Old Testament, the Bible).
 
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Being raised in the Midwest I can remember countless times there were tornado warnings and all families in it's potential path were obviously praying for protection, but in the end some houses would inevitably get wiped while others were left untouched. I have always been curious as to how Christians view these situations? Do you believe it come down who prayed the loudest, or prayed the best or did God already made his decision on who was going to die long before anyone started praying? The reason I ask is because when interviewed afterwards the people who's houses were spared always claim that God listened to their prayers. If you were in that situation is that what you would believe happened? And if so what do you tell your poor neighbors who also prayed but were apparently not heard?

There are differing views such as:

1. Those who say it was the will of God. Beyond that they may have no further explanation, other than
to perhaps add that it's a mystery, we cannot know the details or His thoughts are beyond ours, or He
works all together for good to those that love Him.

2. Those who would say the prayers of the pure & righteous were answered. The rest were not.

3. Those who do not believe in the free will of man & think God causes, directly or indirectly, everything.
Such as Calvinist & many Universalist Christians.
 
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so have we gotten to the part about what happens after we die yet? That is the part I want to start talking about

After death there is resurrection, judgement, Jesus is the Saviour of all mankind, a new universe is created,
everything in it, even the devils Lucifer & Dracula, worship God & lives happily ever after.

Don't believe me? Read everything on tentmaker.org come back in 2 years & tell me i was right.
 

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A feeling of weightlessness. A bright light at the end of a warm tunnel. The ability to see your own body below you, and friends or loved ones—who passed away years ago—now surrounding you in absolute peace. These are just a few of the things described by people who have had a near-death experience. And not all of them are as positive. Some recount a visit to hell, where they were overcome with fear and hopelessness, and even tortured by demons.
While many in the scientific community are skeptical of these accounts, others believe they offer the most definitive proof of life after death we might ever encounter. And though the debate continues, one thing is for certain: These people insist what they went through was life-altering. But by all means, feel free to judge for yourself.
10 Veronika-Ulrike Barthel

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</center>Veronika Barthel says that, after being struck by lightning while driving her car one day in 1981, she was instantly transported into hell, where she found demons escorting her into a big waiting room.
“The creatures that I saw there were more terrifying than anything I even saw in a horror movie. Today I know that they were demons. As soldiers they where marching past me, and in the middle of them were people that were screaming with pain. It was very difficult to breathe down there, because of the terrible smell of this place. I saw a lake, which looked like the inner part of a volcano, where people were cursing because of great pain.”
She says that she saw people being thrown into caves, which were guarded by demons, who threw spears at them as they screamed. She also recalled snakes being present all over the ground, which were there to frighten and intimidate the people in hell.
After her experience, Veronika found herself transported back into her car, where for a moment, she saw her own burning hands gripping the steering wheel.
9 Howard Storm

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Once a self-described “double atheist” and “know-it all college professor,” Howard Storm was leading a three-week European art tour with his students when he retired to his hotel room in France on the last day of the trip. Without warning, he suddenly screamed and dropped to the floor, prompting his wife to call for help. At the hospital, the news was grim: Howard had a perforated stomach that required surgery, and if he didn’t get it soon, he would die.
The wait for a doctor to arrive at the hospital was lengthy—so much so, that Howard turned to his wife at one point and said his final farewell to her, insisting that he was moments from death. That’s when he recalled finding himself standing next to his own body (which was still on the hospital bed) and feeling more alive than ever, with no more stomach pain. Soon after, he heard unfamiliar voices calling to him.
“Come with us,” they said. “Hurry up, let’s go. We’ve been waiting for you.”
After calling out to his wife and getting no response, he began to follow the voices, which led him out of the room and down a long, dark hallway. He followed them for so long, and became so increasingly terrified, that he told the voices he wasn’t going any further. Then they attacked him.
“We had a big fight and the fight turned into them annihilating me, which they did slowly and with much relish,” he says. “Mostly they were biting and tearing at me. This went on for a long time. They did other things to humiliate and violate me which I don’t talk about.”
Collapsed on the ground, Howard began reciting The Lord’s Prayer, after hearing a soft voice tell him to “Pray to God.” After saying a few other other prayers, he said that Jesus personally saved him from the demons, and sent him back to Earth, telling him to live his life differently. Storm’s book, My Descent Into Death, was published in 2000.
8 Dr. Mary Neal

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During a kayaking trip in 1999, Dr. Mary Neal became pinned under the water when her kayak capsized, making it impossible for her to breathe for anywhere between 15 and 25 minutes. That’s when she says she experienced a near-death experience that brought her into the presence of God, Jesus, and angels.
During the experience, God told her that her family would be facing an upcoming tragedy and would need her to help them through. Specifically, her nine-year-old son Willie was going to die—but she wasn’t told when, where, or how. Ten years later, at age 19, Willie was killed in a car accident in Maine by a driver who was on his cell phone.
Mary is convinced Jesus helped her under the water, making it possible for rescue workers to revive her following the kayaking accident. She awoke with two broken legs and lung complications, and spent a month in the hospital, followed by six weeks in a wheelchair. She wrote a book called, To Heaven And Back, which was published in May 2012.
7 Ben Breedlove


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When 18-year-old Ben Breedlove of Austin, Texas began posting a series of videos on YouTube telling the world about his rare heart condition, they instantly went viral, attracting millions of viewers. In one of them, he tells the story of being wheeled down a dark hall by nurses to the surgery room, and seeing a bright, peaceful light near the ceiling. He was four at the time it happened.
Through a series of index cards in the video, he wrote: “There were no lights on in this hall. I couldn’t take my eyes off it, and I couldn’t help but smile. I had no worries at all, like nothing else in the world mattered.” He talks of different times when he “cheated death,” including an incident where he fainted in the hallway at school.
“While I was still unconscious, I was in this white room; no walls, it just went on and on. There was no sound, but that same peaceful feeling I had when I was four. I was wearing a really nice suit, and so was my favorite rapper, Kid Cudi. I then looked at myself in the mirror—I was proud of myself, of my entire life, everything I have done. It was the best feeling. I didn’t want to leave that place. I wish I never woke up.”
Ben’s videos attracted the attention of rapper Kid Cudi, who apparently “broke down” after viewing them. He responded: “I broke down, I am to tears [sic] because I hate how life is so unfair. This has really touched my heart in a way I can’t describe, this is why I do what I do. Why I write my life, and why I love you all so much.”
On Christmas Day 2011, one week after posting the videos, Ben Breedlove suffered a heart attack and died. A family friend stated, “There are times that [the family is] overwhelmed by the pain and the loss of Ben, but then it’s replaced with knowing that he was at peace with what was going to happen.” The final index cards in Ben’s last video stated, “Do you believe in angels or God? I do.”
6 Colton Burpo

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Colton Burpo wasn’t quite four years old when his appendix burst, landing him in a hospital for emergency surgery. And when he awoke two hours later, he had an amazing story to tell. He said he had been to heaven, where he met Jesus, John The Baptist, God, and even family members who had passed away previously—including a baby sister that his mother had lost due to a miscarriage. Neither of his parents had ever mentioned the miscarriage to him.
He also met an old man he called “Pop,” whom he had seen as a young man. Later, he was able to identify Pop in a family photograph as the man he had seen in heaven. It was his paternal grandfather. And while the surgery was taking place, Colton told his father that he had seen him in another room, where he had gone to pray.
His father, Todd Burpo, said, “We knew he wasn’t making it up, because he was able to tell us what we were doing in another part of the hospital. Not even Sonja had seen me in that little room, having my meltdown with God.”
Todd wrote a book called Heaven Is For Real that recounts the entire story of his son’s incredible experience in detail. Colton Burpo now travels the country with his parents, sharing his story with others.
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5 Betty J. Eadie

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In November 1973, Betty Eadie underwent a partial hysterectomy, after which she says she floated out of her body and passed through a tunnel to heaven. She said she was guided by three hooded, monk-like figures who claimed to have always been her guardian angels and informed her that she had died prematurely.
In an excerpt from her book, Embraced By The Light, she recalls:
“I saw a pinpoint of light in the distance. The black mass around me began to take on more of the shape of a tunnel, and I felt myself traveling through it at an even greater speed, rushing toward the light. I was instinctively attracted to it, although again, I felt that others might not be. As I approached it, I noticed the figure of a man standing in it, with the light radiating all around him. There was no questioning who he was, I knew that he was my savior, and friend, and God. He was Jesus Christ, who had always loved me, even when I thought he hated me.”
Following its publication in September 1994, her book became a No. 1 best seller and remains in print today.
4 Don Piper

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Following a pastor’s conference in January 1989, Don Piper was driving over a bridge when a Texas Department of Corrections tractor-trailer truck crossed the center line and ran into him head-on. He said he was “instantly transported to Heaven,” where he found himself surrounded by dead relatives and friends, and a large pearl gate.
“The gate of heaven was a magnificent edifice, the one that I saw. It looked no less like a giant gate that had been sculpted from mother-of-pearl,” he said. “Behind that portal was such a light that I don’t conceive of how you could see it in an earthly body. It could only be envisioned in a heavenly body because it was too bright.”
As he lay there crushed in his vehicle on the bridge, a pastor came by, who prayed over him. The EMS staff had told him that Don was deceased. After the pastor prayed, he instantly found himself back in his vehicle, staring up at a tarp that had been draped over him. At the hospital, it was revealed that, although he suffered no major head trauma, nearly every bone in his body had been broken or shattered. Don wrote a book called 90 Minutes In Heaven after his recovery.
3 Bill Wiese

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In his book 23 Minutes In Hell, author Bill Wiese tells the story of laying in bed at 3:00 AM and being suddenly thrown into the depths of hell, where he was tormented by demons. He said he was placed in a small cell with vicious “beasts” who looked like reptiles. He recalls understanding that they had been assigned to torment him, which they did, throwing him against the walls and piercing his flesh with their claws. The pain became so bad that he wished for death but was not obliged. He said that he heard the cries of millions, who were either burning in hell, or being tortured as he was.
When he awoke, his wife noted that the clock read 3:23, so his book is titled 23 Minutes In Hell.
2 Crystal McVea

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Following a simple medical procedure for pancreatitis in 2009, Crystal McVea of Oklahoma went into full respiratory arrest on the operating table. When that happened, she says she experienced a trip to heaven that renewed her faith in God, whom she met in person. She described him as “an immense brightness,” one that she could “feel, taste, touch, hear, and smell,” and recalled having 500 senses while in heaven, as opposed to the traditional human five.
“I had angels, I had God, and I fell to my knees in front of him,” she said, adding that she’d always been a doubter prior to the experience. When she was asked twice by God if she’d like to return to Earth, she chose to stay both times. But despite her insistence, God sent her back—though not before relieving her of her guilt and shame.
McVea released a book about her experience called Waking Up In Heaven in April 2013.
1 Ian McCormack

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While diving for lobster one day on the island of Mauritius, Ian McCormack was stung on the arm by a box jellyfish. He says that, by the time the ambulance arrived, he already felt completely paralyzed and necrosis had begun to set in. As he lay dying, Ian saw a vision of his mother praying for him, and after he made it to the hospital, he was clinically dead for a period of 15–20 minutes. That’s when he found himself in a very dark place and began to hear people screaming.
“From the darkness I began to hear men’s voices screaming at me telling me to ‘shut up’—that I ‘deserved to be there’—-that I was ‘in Hell.’ I couldn’t believe it, but as I stood there a radiant beam of light shone through the darkness and immediately began to lift me upward. I found myself being translated up into an incredibly brilliant beam of pure white light—it seemed to be emanating from a circular opening far above me (I felt like a speck of dust being drawn up into a beam of sunlight).”
As he walked toward the light, Ian says he could feel it giving off a “living emotion,” and that God then spoke to him. McCormack hasn’t written a book but has shared his story with several news outlets and talk shows.

There is a perfectly reasonable explanation for all of these stories. The #1 explanation being the majority of these people are delusional. But hey whatever helps them sleep at night.
 
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There is a perfectly reasonable explanation for all of these stories. The #1 explanation being the majority of these people are delusional. But hey whatever helps them sleep at night.

If it helps you sleep at night to think that we all got here by evolving from some swamp goo, that evolved from... nothing - well I guess that's cool too.
 

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If it helps you sleep at night to think that we all got here by evolving from some swamp goo, that evolved from... nothing - well I guess that's cool too.

so you believe in god to make yourself feel better?
 

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If it helps you sleep at night to think that we all got here by evolving from some swamp goo, that evolved from... nothing - well I guess that's cool too.

For these people to think they are the chosen ones saved by god, they are delusional.
 

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Here's how you know most people only believe in God out of their own self-interest. If you believe in God, there is logic to that. As archaic is it may seem with all the knowledge we have of the universe today. But there is absolutely not logic to thinking that you will live on forever in some other life that comes after this one.
 

EV Whore
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For these people to think they are the chosen ones saved by god, they are delusional.

I'm not sure but I think most believers hold the opinion that all humans are saved (or capable of being saved). I dunno exactly.
 

FreeRyanFerguson.com
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We know what's right and wrong. We all still do wrong. Hasn't anyone on here ever prayed for forgiveness?
 

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are all those people who have had after life experiences (brought back from dead) all bullshit? Is it just dreams that they had during their rest before/after death/revived?

disclaimer: i am an atheist. i believe in no supernatural powers or sky gods. all things can be explained by scientific evidence and nature. the recent confirmation of the big bang theory is just icing on the cake. religion has no shred of evidence and has caused more deaths and human division than any other ideal. that is fact. mass delusion is never good. i could go on and on and prove their are no gods, but it wouldn't matter. facts have no place in religion, just impossible and silly stories that require faith, no evidence. the definition of faith is " the temporary suspension of rational thought to achieve a desired ideal". but we live in the USA, so have at it it.

the so called near death experience is nothing more than the brain shutting down near death when it is deprived of oxygen. it has been re-created in laboratories across the country, including the most prestigious colleges. neurologists know what parts of the brain shut down first when the brain is dying. volunteers are put in a sensory deprivation chamber. the parts of the brain that die first are stimulated, tricking those parts to go into shutdown mode. this goes on for a while and the people are then interviewed about what happened. WITHOUT FAIL, the same story is told. i saw myself floating over my body with people around my body. i entered a tunnel and a bright light guided me through it. i saw figures of people that looked like they could have been people i know.

sound familiar?? this test has been conducted on more 250,000 people. it's called science.

you can believe what you want, no matter how ridiculous or devoid of fact it is. i don't care about that. i just can't believe otherwise intelligent people could believe something so ridiculous with not a shred of proof and with science disproving it.

religion is mass delusion. that is a recipe for disaster and is the reason the world is in the state it is today. it is responsible for more deaths, racism, the abuse of women and homosexuals, ethnic cleansing, 9/11, arranged marriages including minors, honor rape, suicide bombings. terrorism, judgement and intolerance, burning witches, drinking poisoned kool aid, burning down your dwelling while the FBI is ramming tanks into it, the crusades and inquisitions, bombing abortion clinics, shooting abortion doctors, 40 suicides so they can all meet on the UFO behind the comet, woman getting shot in the town square for getting raped and dishonoring their family, the systematic raping of children by priests and the cover up of it and 1000 other horrific things. if you want to cherry pick your religion and only take the good and not the bad, you are delusional.

so that explains the near death hoax. and be on alert, i have studied religion my whole life and know all the stories and all the facts that disprove it. pack a lunch.

but i guess if it helps you, despite killing billions, it's all good.
 
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disclaimer: i am an atheist. i believe in no supernatural powers or sky gods. all things can be explained by scientific evidence and nature. the recent confirmation of the big bang theory is just icing on the cake. religion has no shred of evidence and has caused more deaths and human division than any other ideal. that is fact. mass delusion is never good. i could go on and on and prove their are no gods, but it wouldn't matter. facts have no place in religion, just impossible and silly stories that require faith, no evidence. the definition of faith is " the temporary suspension of rational thought to achieve a desired ideal". but we live in the USA, so have at it it.

the so called near death experience is nothing more than the brain shutting down near death when it is deprived of oxygen. it has been re-created in laboratories across the country, including the most prestigious colleges. neurologists know what parts of the brain shut down first when the brain is dying. volunteers are put in a sensory deprivation chamber. the parts of the brain that die first are stimulated, tricking those parts to go into shutdown mode. this goes on for a while and the people are then interviewed about what happened. WITHOUT FAIL, the same story is told. i saw myself floating over my body with people around my body. i entered a tunnel and a bright light guided me through it. i saw figures of people that looked like they could have been people i know.

sound familiar?? this test has been conducted on more 250,000 people. it's called science.

you can believe what you want, no matter how ridiculous or devoid of fact it is. i don't care about that. i just can't believe otherwise intelligent people could believe something so ridiculous with not a shred of proof and with science disproving it.

religion is mass delusion. that is a recipe for disaster and is the reason the world is in the state it is today. it is responsible for more deaths, racism, the abuse of women and homosexuals, ethnic cleansing, 9/11, arranged marriages including minors, honor rape, suicide bombings. terrorism, judgement and intolerance, burning witches, drinking poisoned kool aid, burning down your dwelling while the FBI is ramming tanks into it, the crusades and inquisitions, bombing abortion clinics, shooting abortion doctors, 40 suicides so they can all meet on the UFO behind the comet, woman getting shot in the town square for getting raped and dishonoring their family, the systematic raping of children by priests and the cover up of it and 1000 other horrific things. if you want to cherry pick your religion and only take the good and not the bad, you are delusional.

so that explains the near death hoax. and be on alert, i have studied religion my whole life and know all the stories and all the facts that disprove it. pack a lunch.

but i guess if it helps you, despite killing billions, it's all good.

There's so much ignorance and delusion in this post, I don't even know where to start. The Big-Bang is the icing on the cake that disproves religion? BWAHAHAHAHAAHA. Let me educate you.

For centuries scientists taught that the universe was eternal. The prevalent theory in cosmology, was that it was "Steady State" it always existed, and hence no need for a cause.

With the advent of the Big Bang - the universe must have a cause/creator, because it had a definite beginning, and we can calculate backwards from the expanding universe to approximate the date.

Here's a CNN article this past week which says that the Big Bang theory shows strong support for God:

http://religion.blogs.cnn.com/2014/03/20/does-the-big-bang-breakthrough-offer-proof-of-god/

Think about the simple Cosmological argument for the existence of a creator:

1. Everything that begins to exist, must have a cause
2. The universe began to exist
3. Ergo, the universe has a cause/creator


Now, as far as your blather about religion causing deaths in the world:

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Nobody ever killed in the name of atheism. It's as simple as that?

Everything needs a creator? Who created God? You can't just say he's magical and call it a day.

Scientists are the most religious people of all. They are hard at work studying "God's" universe and seeing how "he" did it.

Science bless you.
 

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