How many Pro Sports Bettors are there in Las Vegas?

[Horseshoe]

P.S. Jeff, Once during a fight weekend in LV, I was on a payphone calling up to relatives in the room upstairs at CP to tell of a current number available on the NFL card, when a play from NYC came on their phones simultaneously as a runner in the booth next to me was moving the same very play, when I was asked why I said that I knew that the play was right, I replied "because the runner on the phone next to me with Detroit's area code showing on screen was moving the same side as we speak!"..the beard looked at me wounded or at least surprised at my quick read of him..but hey, we at least verified indirectally to each other the legitimacy of the move.

Detroit and Chicago are well represented in LV.

 

[Skyweasel]

guys betting in Vegas follow the lines and shop without running all over town all day? Please don't say runners, I'm talking about someone who is an invidual, not some betting syndicate kingpin.

 

[WildBill]

Most tend to just play offshore and take an occasional shot at a local book when the value is there. There are informal networks where guys work together and yes they have runners and assistants keeping an eye on things too. If you want to hit a lot of numbers at once just park yourself Downtown and you get a bunch of numbers to shoot at within a 10 minute walking circle. And as mentioned before Vegas isn't quite as quick to move a number so chances are good you have a couple minutes to make your bet before it moves on you.

 

[CoachLT]

Fish, Wild Bill,Horseshoe, and other Vegasguys. Do or did any of you know Mike Lowe who was with Gary Austin when he had the tout service in the late 70s? Also he was with a guy named Nick Diantonio[sp?] who started Pointspread Inc in 1980. I think he also dealt BJ at the Frontier. Also in the late 70s and early 80s there was a guy from NY named Chuck,can't remember his last name, who was a great NBA totals guy. Chuck played softball for County Sports from Long Island and I got to know him from softball. Tall good looking guy. I had money in Austins sports book when they screwed everyone. LT

 

[Horseshoe]

Sky, WB's right, many guys, depending on whether fulltime pro, or work jobs in casino via day, swing, or graves, work together to cover ground, and share action.

Many cappers have shopped overnight lines by hitting the side door at Bally's, Dust, etc..with the same discipline as their real day jobs.

Some guys stare at the DB screen, then jump in their car hoping the number is still there when they get there, which in many LV shops is likely within reason if the biggest groups players aren't behind the drift.

Many LV guys have filled their shopping list by the weekend, and try to avoid the weekend crowds, instead staring at DB and playing from home on the weekend..but sometimes have to hit the streets again for buybacks and presses at great numbers.

Informal groups of friends with common interests is definitely a way to cover more ground.

LT, I was in junior high during the late '70s, but have relatives that were stiffed large by Austin's crime spree.

[This message was edited by Horseshoe on July 04, 2004 at 10:03 PM.]

 

[Phaedrus]

posted by The General:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>
If you got what it takes, then you never need to leave your house except for personal errands. No matter where you live as long as you got an internet connection.
<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

So very true. Although I would count myself among one of the weakest hind-tit cappers on this site, my income is almost entirely derived online and I hardly ever have a need to leave the house. It's blissful being out of the workforce and still making a living, I tells ya.

Also -- although I am very slightly ahead in sports betting overall in the few years I've been at it, I cannot imagine making a living at "just" sports betting. I would be so sick of it within six months that I would be down at the unemployment office begging for a day job. Never try to make your living off of just one thing; you never know what's going to happen. Multiple streams of income are good for you not just in the financial sense, but in the mental toughness of knowing that if Income Stream A dries up tomorrow you'll only be slightly worse off, and that you can always find something else.



Phaedrus

 

[Horseshoe]

LT, as for the Chuck question, it seems like one for Scotty S(as does this whole thread), I do remember as a kid seeing a "Chuck/Chuckie" as a smart-mark on the schedules, but am not sure if it is Chuck Sharp, Chuck Shaupp, or another Chuck?

My hunch says Chuck Sharp(if from NYC and being NBA totals), whom an article that I read in the last year, states even Stu Ungar was supposedly following to get out of the financial abyss years ago.

Someone will give you the right answer before long.

P.S. OldmanTed and WildBill are so true, almost to a man, every pro I've encountered has varying levels of regret, knowing that they had the smarts to have lived a better overall quality of balanced life if followed other paths. Even the majority of millionaire sportsbettors and BMs I've known and met, that have actually lasted with their 1st wives(very rare), the few that rarely went bust, the ones that put their kids through the best schools, give bonuses to their workers, and their families have never or rarely known want.

Be careful what you wish for!

[This message was edited by Horseshoe on July 05, 2004 at 01:05 AM.]

 

[OMNIVOROUS FROG]

Las Vegas Nevada? Gaming Commission? La Brae tar pit of sports betting. Only the leftover dinosaurs wander that area. Anybody who was moving anything through sportsbooks, not locals, left there when messenger betting got illegal and corporations bought everything. Just like old slots and single deck BJ. The evolution is to low juice/exchanges. And it will be the industry leader very soon. Try this Las Vegas test. Walk into any book, ask what their limit is on a MAC football game, and then try and bet it. See what happens next. Any book...Best Wishes...OF

 

[WildBill]

It is definitely a life for a loner. Lots try to have a family life and all, but pro gambling is without a doubt a life made for a loner no matter what game you play. Even the poker guys who have the closest thing to a normal work life still are far better off if they can change their hours on a dime for awhile because some live ones are playing hours they aren't. Or if a couple of live ones are spending 6 figures on a game in another state, you have to get out there to maximize your earn. Now compare that to a job where if you get sent out of town for a job you are probably getting a raise or very well paid to start with and everything is paid for. A few people are maximizing their earn being pro gamblers, but I suspect at least 80% of the winners could make more elsewhere with their big seed money, but they don't for whatever reason.

 

[wilheim]

Shoe, last I heard Chuck Sharp was living in the Far East. His NBA totals in the 80's and early to mid 90's would move numbers 2 to 3 points whith seconds after he played. His NBA sides were also well respected.


wil.

 

[WildBill]

Chuck Sharp...couldn't remember the name. Someone told me Jimmy V. supposedly went to the stupid ass moneyline system on NBA thanks to Chuck (ie. when he took a Chuck hit on a game at over 89, he made it over 89 -25 instead of moving the number as everyone else would). Thankfully that never really caught on, but the people I knew back then told me Jimmy always made it -20 or -25 to make sure Chuck just didn't hammer him back on the other side for an almost instant middle. Maybe Jimmy V can refute this if he ever wanders in here anymore, but I heard that from a pretty good source...

 

[wilheim]

Don't remember that happening (doesn't mean it didn't). I do recall spending many a morning at the Mirage around 9AM waiting for NBA numbers to get hung. First stop was Stardust lottery at 8AM then down to Jimmy V's store playing ranges - looking to lay 2 or take 6 (example) on an NBA game.


wil.

 

[Horseshoe]

WB, I agree, have even saw where Fezzik joked/lamented on his site a few months ago, that he wished he was as blessed with Poker skills as his math tools.

Wil, I remember NBA totals being the rage back then, and the Nugget, Spurs, and Buck games specifically, Sharp and Chinaman both had their eras that made the board dance..be it on cash, on air, or from the followers.

BB destroyed the NBA expansion year of '89-'90 about as good as any NBA display that I ever recall also..unreal!

 

[wilheim]

The Chinaman - remember his era well. I believe he only played at the window, but when he did a side might move from 2.5 to 5 in 20 minutes or less. The Nuggets of David Thompson and Spurs of George Gervin were the over the total rage. Getting down on REAL BB sides was always sweet, but never easy. I was lucky a few years getting Chuck's stuff early.


wil.

 

[jwblue]

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>when asked he told me over the course of the year he is hitting at or around 59%...saays he makes about ninety thou a year and does what the hell he wants to do...golf swim go to the sportsbooks at three or four different casinos..check lines and gambles...eats like a king at any casino he and his wife choose....while i'm out there humping by butt off to make 60,000 yearly...this guy has the life....thanks for the time jeffksu....<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

WHAT A LIFE!

 

[jwblue]

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>when asked he told me over the course of the year he is hitting at or around 59%...saays he makes about ninety thou a year and does what the hell he wants to do...golf swim go to the sportsbooks at three or four different casinos..check lines and gambles...eats like a king at any casino he and his wife choose....while i'm out there humping by butt off to make 60,000 yearly...this guy has the life....thanks for the time jeffksu....<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

WHAT A LIFE!

IS

 

[TheFunkMonkey]

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by FISHHEAD:
Consider this fact about MAKING A LIVING.

In Vegas, you could theoretically make about 1/5 the amount of money say of somebody living in Indiana.

You could live in a hotel for free, eat for free, drink for free, never need a car, etc., etc.

Is this making a DECENT LIVING???

I mean, an individaul could be making $50,000 a year in Indiana at a 9-5 job, be married and have 3 kids..............is that person making a BETTER LIVING than the guy in Vegas making $10,000 and having basically NO expenses??

It all depends on the individual.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

How much would you have to gamble in order to be comped (room, food, drink) on a year-long basis?

$500 per day? $5,000 per day?

 

[CoachLT]

Chuck Sharp, what a guy! He was always gracious when I visited my friend Mike Lowe. Chuck was also a great softball player from County Sports in Long Island. They were national champions in the late 60s. I was a young, dumb, semi virile guy back then.What memories. I also got to know Mort Olshan and his son Gary back then. Both great guys. Now I am a older,a little wiser,worn out, retired after 29 years firefighter.
Since my retirement my success ratio has really improved. I have a lot more time to cap and shop for numbers. If you were caught gambling on station computers you could be fired. Porn was semi OK but not gambling. I will say that it is great to not have the pressure of having to do this full time for a living. Thanks for the great topic and the stroll down memory lane. I really look forward to meeting ALL of you distingushed gentlemen @ The RX Bash! LT