Great News From California!!!

[barman]

It's really not that big a deal.

ZIT's kids (soon to be adults) and anyone else who wants to marry someone of same gender can simply relocate to Canada, Massachusetts, Connecticut or another future state which does not use the government to intrude on adult personal choices.

 

[steaktartar]

They should have banned all marriages.

:lolBIG:

 

[RDC-3]

Jesus made it very clear that antiquated OT laws and doctrines were not key to eternal salvation.

But of course it's not cool anymore in this country to live by Christ's teachings.

whats ur address so I can send a bouquet of flowers to you and ur fiance, Ted.

 

[teazeman]

They should have banned all marriages.

that would have saved me one small fortune and part of anotherhno:hno:hno:

 

[erjaq]

its a detestable sin in God's eye(Leviticus). and thats what should matter.But of course its not cool anymore in this country to live by God's law.

You're right.

In fact, it hasn't been cool since the country was founded. Need I remind you about the separation of church and state?

It's a basic right to follow whatever faith you choose. It's also a basic right not to follow whatever religion you choose.

You're 100% right that it is a sin as determined by the Bible. Furthermore, I believe that the church has every right to exclude homosexuals. The state, on the other hand, should have nothing to say about the matter whatsoever.

 

[Spytheweb]

its a detestable sin in God's eye(Leviticus). and thats what should matter.But of course its not cool anymore in this country to live by God's law.

Which god are talking about, there are alot of gods:

• Baha'i
• Buddhism
• Christianity
• Confucianism
• Hinduism
• Islam
• Jainism
• Judaism
• Shinto
• Sikhism
• Taoism
• Zoroastrianism

It all comes down to who you are and where you live.

 

[barman]

STW, you neglected to include one of the increasingly popular deities - the vaunted FSM.

 

[hippieki11er]

Jesus made it very clear that antiquated OT laws and doctrines were not key to eternal salvation.

I'm sorry mamatried, this is completely false, but sadly not an uncommon belief by many fellow Christians. In fact, Christ directly orders us to obey the laws of the Hebrew Bible. It couldn't be more clear:

"Do not think that I [Jesus] have come to abolish the Law or the Prophets; I have not come to abolish them but to fulfill them. I tell you the truth, until heaven and earth disappear, not the smallest letter, not the least stroke or a pen, will by any means disappear from the Law until everything is accomplished." (Matthew 5:17-18)

"Then Jesus said to the crowds and to his disciples: 'The teachers of the law and the Pharisees sit in Moses' seat. So you must obey them and do everything they tell you. But do not do what they do, for they do not practice what they preach.'" (Matthew 23:1-3)

But of course it's not cool anymore in this country to live by Christ's teachings.

Agreed.

 

[RDC-3]

thanks for posting that above "hippie." I dont know where that guy ever read that by Christ.....like some they create myths to fit their agenda.

 

[festeringZit]

Jesus made it very clear that antiquated OT laws and doctrines were not key to eternal salvation.

But of course it's not cool anymore in this country to live by Christ's teachings.

Whether from a pulpit or at a gay rights event, gay activists like to point out that Jesus never addressed the issue of homosexuality; instead, He was more interested in love. Their point is that if Jesus didn't specifically forbid a behavior, then who are we to judge those who engage in it? This argument assumes that the Gospels are more important than the rest of the books in the New Testament, that only the recorded sayings of Jesus matter. But John's gospel itself assures us that it is not an exhaustive record of all that Jesus said and did, which means there was a lot left out!(11) The gospels don't record that Jesus condemned wife-beating or incest; does that make them OK? Furthermore, the remaining books of the New Testament are no less authoritative than the gospels. All scripture is inspired by God, not just the books with red letters in the text. Specific prohibitions against homosexual behavior in Romans 1:26-27 and 1 Corinthians 6:9,10 are every bit as God-ordained as what is recorded in the gospels.
We do know, however, that Jesus spoke in specific terms about God's created intent for human sexuality: "From the beginning of the creation God made them male and female. For this cause shall a man leave his father and mother, and cleave to his wife; and the two shall be one flesh. . . What therefore God has joined together, let not man put asunder" (Matt. 19:4-6). God's plan is holy heterosexuality, and Jesus spelled it out.

 

[Conan]

You're right.

In fact, it hasn't been cool since the country was founded. Need I remind you about the separation of church and state?

It's a basic right to follow whatever faith you choose. It's also a basic right not to follow whatever religion you choose.

You're 100% right that it is a sin as determined by the Bible. Furthermore, I believe that the church has every right to exclude homosexuals. The state, on the other hand, should have nothing to say about the matter whatsoever.

It doesn't take a church to decry that men marrying men isn't how it should be. And it's not solely a Christian belief in the Christian religion either. There is no society in the history of this planet that's supported homosexual marriage. Marriage is marriage PERIOD and that involves a man and a woman. I don't give a rip if 2 gays want to live together and share the same bed or share tax returns. But marriage is still marriage and that's between a man and a woman. It's the foundation of our species and the foundation of its survival. Don't fuck with it.

 

[erjaq]

Whether from a pulpit or at a gay rights event, gay activists like to point out that Jesus never addressed the issue of homosexuality; instead, He was more interested in love. Their point is that if Jesus didn't specifically forbid a behavior, then who are we to judge those who engage in it? This argument assumes that the Gospels are more important than the rest of the books in the New Testament, that only the recorded sayings of Jesus matter. But John's gospel itself assures us that it is not an exhaustive record of all that Jesus said and did, which means there was a lot left out!(11) The gospels don't record that Jesus condemned wife-beating or incest; does that make them OK? Furthermore, the remaining books of the New Testament are no less authoritative than the gospels. All scripture is inspired by God, not just the books with red letters in the text. Specific prohibitions against homosexual behavior in Romans 1:26-27 and 1 Corinthians 6:9,10 are every bit as God-ordained as what is recorded in the gospels.
We do know, however, that Jesus spoke in specific terms about God's created intent for human sexuality: "From the beginning of the creation God made them male and female. For this cause shall a man leave his father and mother, and cleave to his wife; and the two shall be one flesh. . . What therefore God has joined together, let not man put asunder" (Matt. 19:4-6). God's plan is holy heterosexuality, and Jesus spelled it out.

FZ, you're right. It should be plainly obvious to anybody, gay, straight, or otherwise, that God didn't "create Adam and Steve," to distill the argument down a bit.

However, that's missing the point. The real point is that it shouldn't matter in the slightest -- when it comes to legislation, propositions, government, etc. -- what the Bible says. When I say "it shouldn't matter...", I mean "according to the Constitution, it doesn't matter."

Whenever gays try to get accepted by the church, I just shake my head. Why would you want to join a group of people who openly detest you? Now, in this country the church is free to condemn whatever the hell they want (pun intended). The danger is that the church has the ability to influence the law. That is truly scary, and something that all people who value their freedom should be against.

 

[erjaq]

It doesn't take a church to decry that men marrying men isn't how it should be. And it's not solely a Christian belief in the Christian religion either. There is no society in the history of this planet that's supported homosexual marriage. Marriage is marriage PERIOD and that involves a man and a woman. I don't give a rip if 2 gays want to live together and share the same bed or share tax returns. But marriage is still marriage and that's between a man and a woman. It's the foundation of our species and the foundation of its survival. Don't fuck with it.

Um, no. The survival of the species does not depend on marriage. It merely depends on sex. (Yes, sex between a man and a woman.) This sex does not need to happen within the context of a marriage. I think we can both agree on this, yeah?

 

[festeringZit]

FZ, you're right. It should be plainly obvious to anybody, gay, straight, or otherwise, that God didn't "create Adam and Steve," to distill the argument down a bit.

However, that's missing the point. The real point is that it shouldn't matter in the slightest -- when it comes to legislation, propositions, government, etc. -- what the Bible says. When I say "it shouldn't matter...", I mean "according to the Constitution, it doesn't matter."

Whenever gays try to get accepted by the church, I just shake my head. Why would you want to join a group of people who openly detest you? Now, in this country the church is free to condemn whatever the hell they want (pun intended). The danger is that the church has the ability to influence the law. That is truly scary, and something that all people who value their freedom should be against.

Clue: All of our judicial system was/is based on judeo-christian values

 

[festeringZit]

It doesn't take a church to decry that men marrying men isn't how it should be. And it's not solely a Christian belief in the Christian religion either. There is no society in the history of this planet that's supported homosexual marriage. Marriage is marriage PERIOD and that involves a man and a woman. I don't give a rip if 2 gays want to live together and share the same bed or share tax returns. But marriage is still marriage and that's between a man and a woman. It's the foundation of our species and the foundation of its survival. Don't fuck with it.

Ding Ding Ding... We have a winner.

 

[erjaq]

Clue: All of our judicial system was/is based on judeo-christian values

Re-clue: No, it wasn't.

 

[mamatried]

whats ur address so I can send a bouquet of flowers to you and ur fiance, Ted.

What a wit! What are you, in like fifth grade?

 

[kingbill]

Can someone give me a non-religious reason why it should be banned?

 

[mamatried]

I'm sorry mamatried, this is completely false, but sadly not an uncommon belief by many fellow Christians. In fact, Christ directly orders us to obey the laws of the Hebrew Bible. It couldn't be more clear:

"Do not think that I [Jesus] have come to abolish the Law or the Prophets; I have not come to abolish them but to fulfill them. I tell you the truth, until heaven and earth disappear, not the smallest letter, not the least stroke or a pen, will by any means disappear from the Law until everything is accomplished." (Matthew 5:17-18)

"Then Jesus said to the crowds and to his disciples: 'The teachers of the law and the Pharisees sit in Moses' seat. So you must obey them and do everything they tell you. But do not do what they do, for they do not practice what they preach.'" (Matthew 23:1-3)



Agreed.

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Look, I'm not arguing that a case can't be made that homosexuality is an abomination based on sections of the Old Testament and the letters of Paul. I'm only saying that, in my opinion, at least an an equally strong case can be made that Christ's teachings and admonitions concerned much more basic and important precepts than one's sexual preference. It is not for me or you or anyone here to make that judgment.


And, even if I were to accept your interpretation, it is certainly not our place to insist that others accept our religious beliefs as the guidepost for their lives.

 

[hippieki11er]

thanks for posting that above "hippie." I dont know where that guy ever read that by Christ.....like some they create myths to fit their agenda.

Mamatried has never seemed to have an "agenda" and has always appeared a proud Christian. The truth is that there's always been much theological debate between Catholics and Protestants of all denominations about where exactly the Hebrew Bible fits into a Christian's life. In fact, most of the Christians here who aren't afraid to post about their beliefs have stated that Christians aren't "required" to believe in the OT, which falls directly in line with what many churches (unfortunately imo) have preached. I don't agree with that position (and can provide endless scriptural proof that imo supports my position), as you apparently don't either, but it's a central theological debate that remains.

The increasing trend, however, is that the OT is gaining a stronger foothold in Christian churches across the board and there's a Hebrew "rebirth" of some sort taking place here. No longer are churches discouraging us from opening our OT's and many have already abandoned supersessionism and replacement ideology entirely. Not only can the Jewish covenant not be denied, but it's the absolute basis of our scriptural fulfillment as Christians. God Bless.