EWINNER bottom line for me....

Halifax · Sep 30, 2003

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote">quote:<HR>Originally posted by nets2k2:
Circumvent the betting limit and pick up extra bonuses. If I get caught, I will come here and post cause I know all you mods will back me up. You guys will say Rio and Betpanama take away his bonuses(fine by me) and charge him the fees for the money transfers(again fine by me). In the end I get down much more then I ever could at these books, and will be paid.
Actually I should add Gameday to the rotation also now. They love to cut my limits to nothing, might as well get a few quick pops in there also.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Fishhead:

I think this should have adequately answered your question.

Any more ?

JoeyC · Sep 30, 2003

Try this on for size:

Sir Bet plants a story about E Winner, they go tap, run on the bankd and SB takes over the joint?

Possible??

Fishhead · Sep 30, 2003

Let me see if I got this right. Your going to set up 10 accounts with RIO first and foremost to get a bonus? Is that correct? Your going to send say 1,000 to Rio on 10 different accounts to get a 10% bonus. Why not send 10,000 somewhere else and get a 25% bonus? Before I move on, could you answer this first part first please. THANKS

nets2k2 · Sep 30, 2003

Wrong Fishhead, the bonus I really dont care about. Its just extra gravy. So I'll postup 10 dimes each under 12 accounts. Now I can circumvent the betting limits with my 12 accounts. If I dont get caught, cool I just made a quick score and took their bonus money off of them also. If I get caught, its fine, they can have their bonus money back but I still get to keep all my winnings from all 12 accounts.

If Rio, Panama, Gameday try to fight me, and just want to send back my postups, I will just say hey look at this thread about Ewinnner, look at Sickgamblers case. PAY ME ALL MY MONEY. WHO CARES IF I BROKE YOUR RULES. PAY ME MY MONEY. And you guys will back me up 110%.

Fishhead · Sep 30, 2003

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote">quote:<HR>Originally posted by nets2k2:
Wrong Fishhead, the bonus I really dont care about. Its just extra gravy. So I'll postup 10 dimes each under 12 accounts. Now I can circumvent the betting limits with my 12 accounts. If I dont get caught, cool I just made a quick score and took their bonus money off of them also. If I get caught, its fine, they can have their bonus money back but I still get to keep all my winnings from all 12 accounts.

If Rio, Panama, Gameday try to fight me, and just want to send back my postups, I will just say hey look at this thread about Ewinnner, look at Sickgamblers case. PAY ME ALL MY MONEY. WHO CARES IF I BROKE YOUR RULES. PAY ME MY MONEY. And you guys will back me up 110%.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Pardon me, but I make money the old fashioned way, I earn it. Having said that and proving my ignorance, how will you go about "circumventing" the lines as you say? Or actually, you say your CIRCUMVENTING the limits.....sorry. Me bad. Please explain.

Halifax · Sep 30, 2003

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote">quote:<HR>
Pardon me, but I make money the old fashioned way, I earn it. Having said that and proving my ignorance, how will you go about "circumventing" the lines as you say? Or actually, you say your CIRCUMVENTING the limits.....sorry. Me bad. Please explain.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

I assume you are joking, or purposely playing dumb.

If you really can't see how he's able to circumvent betting limits by doing this, you really should have paid better attention to your Grade 3 Math teacher.

nets2k2 · Sep 30, 2003

Fishhead, dont worry about how I will circumvent the lines. Bottomline is you all say its okay to have multiple accounts and the books must pay the winnings. They dont have to pay the bonuses, but they must pay the winnings. So now a bunch of books are in HUGE trouble. Some people will be caught and some wont. In the end a bunch of books are going to be giving bonuses to the same person 5 times, 10 times, 20 times, 100 times. And if these guys are sharp they are gonna take much more then just the bonuses off the books.

And how you make your money the oldfashioned way is not relevant to this thread. I am quoting what you said earlier about books who are getting double-popped on a game "have no business bookmaking" I proved to you that any book here can get double-popped and now you guys are even endorsing it. So with your reasoning all books should close shop immediately.

sqrchris · Sep 30, 2003

These scammers are laughing all the way to the bank. Therfe is no deterant to not scam like this. Another black eye for the offshore industry.

These people are known scammers, this isnt as innocent as two college kids sharing a computer, making the same bets.

docdekay · Sep 30, 2003

Fish
are you fu(king kidding me?

TheGeneral+ · Sep 30, 2003

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote">quote:<HR>Originally posted by Joey C:
Try this on for size:

Sir Bet plants a story about E Winner, they go tap, run on the bankd and SB takes over the joint?

Possible??<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

I love conspiracies

Fishhead · Sep 30, 2003

DONT AVOID THE QUESTION!

I want to know how you are going to "Circumvent" the line with your 10 accounts at RIO. Or is this some big secret? Your an honest fella, let the entire posting world know how you would accomplish this. Thanks again for your time.

nets2k2 · Sep 30, 2003

Docdekay, He is either trying to play dumb and lure me into saying yea its all about the bonuses or he really doesnt know. If he is trying to lure me into saying its about the bonuses then he can call me a bonuswhore or whatever and try to win the argument that way. Unfortunately for him, its not really about the bonuses. Like I said earlier thats just extra gravy.

What the Rx has done is opened up a can of worms. Dont be suprised now if every week someone here comes and posts about Rio stiffing them. Or WWTS stiffing them. The truth will come out they had more then one account, but that will be okay as long as the books keep whatever bonuses these guys recieved. The Rx has now set the precedent that it is okay to have multiple accounts. You just cant get paid on multiple bonuses. Yea this does nothing for the small bettors, but they just killed the books by letting the big bettors have at it.

nets2k2 · Sep 30, 2003

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote">quote:<HR>Originally posted by STRUT888/FISHHEAD:
DONT AVOID THE QUESTION!

I want to know how you are going to "Circumvent" the line with your 10 accounts at RIO. Or is this some big secret? Your an honest fella, let the entire posting world know how you would accomplish this. Thanks again for your time.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Strut your making yourself look stupid now. You already lost the argument. You are trying to sidetrack. If you want to know how, go ask the Shrink or your fellow Mods. I am sure they can explain it to you.

Once again, Rx congrats on killing all these books.

WildBill · Sep 30, 2003

You know the dumb thing about this is if books avoided this problem by putting a hold on a line for 20 seconds after a limit bet online, the people would be bitching too. You just can't make everyone happy, but I have to agree that they shouldn't take their money just for this transgression. After all that is why there are rollover requirements and limits. Properly applied the bonus is paid for by action and the limits prevent someone from double popping at the same price.

As many fine executives say, there are times when the customer isn't right. You can treat them well, but you can't let them run you and your employees over. If people think your policies are crappy, but they are there to protect your business and your people then you stand proudly and say hey I do my business my way, if you don't like it we will miss you as a customer but we will stand by our desire to do things our way.

Fishhead · Sep 30, 2003

Your supposed to be "circumventing" the lines or limits. I see I am proving my point. How is the RIO going to allow you to do this.

BONUSES??? Apparrently you were not going for a bigger bonus because obviously you could have sent all your money in at once or sent it somewhere else for a bigger bonus. Like you mentioned, you set up the 12 accounts so as a potential scammer you could "circumvent" the limits. PLEASE EXPLAIN THIS TO ME AND THE POSTING WORLD HOW YOU WILL DO THIS TO RIO. Thanks guy.

Halifax · Sep 30, 2003

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote">quote:<HR>Originally posted by STRUT888/FISHHEAD:
Your supposed to be "circumventing" the lines or limits. I see I am proving my point. How is the RIO going to allow you to do this.

BONUSES??? Apparrently you were not going for a bigger bonus because obviously you could have sent all your money in at once or sent it somewhere else for a bigger bonus. Like you mentioned, you set up the 12 accounts so as a potential scammer you could "circumvent" the limits. PLEASE EXPLAIN THIS TO ME AND THE POSTING WORLD HOW YOU WILL DO THIS TO RIO. Thanks guy.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

"I see I am proving my point." LMAO

I nominate this for bonehead post of the month.

Nets could have said he would open up multiple accounts at BoDog for 25% bonus instead of Rio, if that would make you happier ... same difference. What is your argument ?

Think before you post ... and what the hell is "circumventing the line" ??

Fishhead · Sep 30, 2003

How are you going to CIRCUMVENT the limits at RIO? Explain slowly and step-by-step.

Java · Sep 30, 2003

Halifax and Nets2k2-
Great posts (as always). Patrick does have some excellent points too. The problem, as I see it, is:

1) If you allow the books to confiscate funds on winnings (bonuses different story), you are giving them a license to past-post.

2) If you allow players to have multiple accounts, you are saying the book has no right to enforce wager limits per player. (IP address is only ONE tool in the arsensal to detect multiple accounts, so kids at same school is red herring.)

So, given these two apparently contradictory positions, you need RULES clearly spelling out the policy for multiple accounts.

Proposed rules for multiple account holders:

1) Players must certify to book that they have only one account and are subject to following rules if caught with additional account.

2) Any player caught with more than one account will be banned, forfeit any bonuses, and be banned from further play at the book. Players may not make plays for other players/friends that already have accounts.

3) Player may not be an affiliate or agent and also play using any accounts under that affiliate/agent. (This is like playing with a built in discount.) Caught doing this forfeits any agent commissions.

4) Players violating this rule may be subject to their identity being shared with other sportsbooks.

5) The books evidence must consist of more than merely IP address, such as: include times of wagers, type/size of bet, deposit/withdrawal patterns, telephone numbers, voice on tape, etc. (the more the stronger the case)

6) Book will not confiscate actual winnings, but may freeze account for 30 days (may need phone records or other investigation). Book may withhold funds to protect against chargebacks for losses of monies deposited by credit card for up to 1 year (or whatever the chargeback time is).

I think this would make it pretty damn clear that multiple account holders are not welcome.

nets2k2 · Sep 30, 2003

CIRCUMVENTING THE LIMIT STRUTHEAD. DO YOU UNDERSTAND WHAT THAT MEANS? IF THE LIMIT IS 3DIMES AND NOW I HAVE 12 ACCOUNTS, GUESS WHAT THAT MAKES??? 12accounts multiplied by 3dimes = 36dimes. 36 > 3 so now guess what that means??? Yes it means 36dimes is greater than 3dimes. I just circumvented the LIMITS.

Shrink, I never like to get anyone fired from their job. But hire people who actually know some things.

Goodnight Fishhead. Take care of yourself.

TTinCO · Sep 30, 2003

When it's all done and over with, the problem with this is that the forum appears to be supporting this practice which is already a serious problem in the offshore industry.

If it's going to become a fully accepted practice, why not change the rules to reflect reality and eliminate that gray area between print & reality?

If you're going to let everyone screw books senseless, don't bitch when your bonuses & other perks disappear.

It's a very dangerous standard to be supporting.