DHS Intelligence Report Warns of Terror Threat - Not from ISIS, but a similar foe... Right Wing Extremists

[The Guesser]

LaVoy Finicum — the Oregon militant beneath the blue tarp — killed in police shootout: reports

TRAVIS GETTYS
26 JAN 2016 AT 22:24 ET [/COLOR]

Lavoy Finicum announces his intention to refuse a warrant for his arrest on Jan. 5, 2016. (MSNBC)
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LaVoy Finicum — the Oregon militant who gained fame for conducting a television interview from beneath a blue tarp — has reportedly been shot and killed by law enforcement officers.
The Arizona rancher, who was caring for 11 foster children with his wife, vowed at the start of the occupation of the Malheur National Wildlife Preserve that he was willing to die for his interpretation of the U.S. Constitution.
“I have been raised in the country all my life,” Finicum said in a widely viewed television interview with a rifle on his lap. “I love dearly to feel the wind on my face. To see the sun rise, to see the moon. I have no intention of spending any of my days in a concrete box.”
He was reportedly shot Tuesday evening during a shootout when law enforcement officers stopped a group of militants on their way to establish a shadow government in nearby Grant County.
State Rep. Michele Fiore (R), who is close to the Bundy family and other militants, has identified Finicum as the militant who has been reportedly killed.
Six others — including Ammon and Ryan Bundy — were arrested following the shootout.
Reports indicate that one other person might have been wounded in the gunfire.

 

[superbeets]

 

[superbeets]

A pair of hungry eagles got into a bit of a scuffle as they fought over the same meal along the the shores of the Mississippi River in Rock Island, Illinois

 

[Acebb]

[h=1]FBI Thwarts Mass Shooting Planned By Muslim At Masonic Temple In Milwaukee[/h]

And what is the resident sewer-rat doing? Pretending people encamped at a wildlife refuge that sick rat couldn't point to on a map if someone gave it a month supply of adult diapers, are the same as ISIS.

Just a sick, unbelievably disgusting rat.

 

[ScottL]

We don't even hear about most of the plots to blow shit up and bullet riddle a room full of coworkers by Muslims because they get stopped before getting close to becoming operational. To be fair though I'm sure a lot of the tipsters are also Muslim. There will always be Rightwing nutcases. And they will always lose because the FBI will have 26 guns pointed in the face of every one of them. But these people all act out for different reasons.

OTOH with radical Islam we're battling an ideological sickness that is both organized (AQ, al Nusra, etc) and disorganized (married couples and other crazies). And these loons are coming like a tidal wave. And we don't even know their names until there's a body count. So really, does what DHS says really matter? Reasonable people know where the battlefield is and who is on it.

 

[The Guesser]

We don't even hear about most of the plots to blow shit up and bullet riddle a room full of coworkers by Muslims because they get stopped before getting close to becoming operational. To be fair though I'm sure a lot of the tipsters are also Muslim. There will always be Rightwing nutcases. And they will always lose because the FBI will have 26 guns pointed in the face of every one of them. But these people all act out for different reasons.

OTOH with radical Islam we're battling an ideological sickness that is both organized (AQ, al Nusra, etc) and disorganized (married couples and other crazies). And these loons are coming like a tidal wave. And we don't even know their names until there's a body count. So really, does what DHS says really matter? Reasonable people know where the battlefield is and who is on it.

They are BOTH sick ideologies. Our Gov't has done a better job of infiltrating Muslim terrorist cells and foiled their plots, thankfully. Reasonable people do indeed know who is on the battlefield. BOTH sick ideologies.

[h=1]You Are More Than 7 Times As Likely To Be Killed By A Right-Wing Extremist Than By Muslim Terrorists[/h]BY IAN MILLHISER NOV 30, 2015 8:00 AM

CREDIT: AP PHOTO

A terrorist group marches through the streets of Swainsboro, Georgia in 1948.

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Friday afternoon, one week after elected officials all over the country tried to block Syrian refugees from entering their states in an apparent effort to fight terrorism, a white man in Colorado committed what appears to be an act of terrorism in a Planned Parenthood clinic.
Though the details of Robert Lewis Dear’s motives for killing three people in the clinic and injuring nine others are still being revealed, Dear reportedly told law enforcement “no more baby parts,” an apparent reference to heavily edited videos produced by the Center for Medical Progress, which numerous politicians have cited to falsely claim that Planned Parenthood sells “aborted baby parts.” Dear’s actions, in other words, appear to be an act of politically motivated terrorism directed against an institution widely reviled by conservatives.
Though terrorism perpetrated by Muslims receives a disproportionate amount of attention from politicians and reporters, the reality is that right-wing extremists pose a much greater threat to people in the United States than terrorists connected to ISIS or similar organizations. As UNC Professor Charles Kurzman and Duke Professor David Schanzer explained last June in the New York Times, Islam-inspired terror attacks “accounted for 50 fatalities over the past 13 and a half years.” Meanwhile, “right-wing extremists averaged 337 attacks per year in the decade after 9/11, causing a total of 254 fatalities.”
Kurzman and Schanzer’s methodology, moreover, may underestimate the degree to which domestic terrorists in the United States are motivated by right-wing views. As they describe the term in their New York Times piece, the term “right-wing extremist” primarily encompasses anti-government extremists such as members of the sovereign citizen movement, although it also includes racist right-wing groups such as neo-Nazis. Thus, it is not yet clear whether Dear, who made anti-abortion remarks but also reportedly referenced President Obama, was motivated in part by the kind of anti-government views that are the focus of Kurzman and Schanzer’s inquiry.
Kurzman and Schanzer also surveyed hundreds of law enforcement agencies regarding their assessment of various threats. Of the 382 agencies they spoke with, “74 percent reported anti-government extremism as one of the top three terrorist threats in their jurisdiction,” while only “39 percent listed extremism connected with Al Qaeda or like-minded terrorist organizations.”
Meanwhile, the percentage of refugees that are connected to terrorist plots is vanishingly small.

 

[ScottL]

Guesser you just don't get it. How you can repeat my words which are as clear as can be and use them as a point in your disagreement belies all logic.

As I said reasonable people understand why the ideology of radical Islam is more dangerous to innocent Americans than the Freemen, or whoever else is occupying an empty building and refusing to shower for a week. When the first deli, broadway show or Walmart is blown up or invaded by masked men with rifles in NYC they won't be white guys. That shouldn't need further explanation.

 

[The Guesser]

Guesser you just don't get it. How you can repeat my words which are as clear as can be and use them as a point in your disagreement belies all logic.

As I said reasonable people understand why the ideology of radical Islam is more dangerous to innocent Americans than the Freemen, or whoever else is occupying an empty building and refusing to shower for a week. When the first deli, broadway show or Walmart is blown up or invaded by masked men with rifles in NYC they won't be white guys. That shouldn't need further explanation.

Scott, we agree about Radical Islamist Terrorism. But you're refusal to see Extreme Anti Gov't Terrorists in a similar light, in spite of Law Enforcement statistics and warnings, is baffling. Reasonable people understand that they are BOTH threats.

 

[ScottL]

Scott, we agree about Radical Islamist Terrorism. But you're refusal to see Extreme Anti Gov't Terrorists in a similar light, in spite of Law Enforcement statistics and warnings, is baffling. Reasonable people understand that they are BOTH threats.

I'll tell you what. I'll go to an anti-Government meeting in Oregon and tell these guys they're doing it all wrong.

You go to a meeting of jihadis (pick your own location) and tell them they've got it all wrong.

I'll walk out alive. You'll be carried out, neck and below. Where they put the stake with your head on it Allah knows.

 

[The Guesser]

I'll tell you what. I'll go to an anti-Government meeting in Oregon and tell these guys they're doing it all wrong.

You go to a meeting of jihadis (pick your own location) and tell them they've got it all wrong.

I'll walk out alive. You'll be carried out, neck and below. Where they put the stake with your head on it Allah knows.

Doubtful either of us would walk out too healthy, dealing with these fanatical sickos. Look, I get it, to you only one of these sick groups is wrong. Reasonable folks KNOW they both are sick and need to be monitored, infiltrated, and stopped. If you want to continue debating it, fine, but you aren't going to change my mind, nor me yours. :toast:

 

[SheriffJoe]

I'll tell you what. I'll go to an anti-Government meeting in Oregon and tell these guys they're doing it all wrong.

You go to a meeting of jihadis (pick your own location) and tell them they've got it all wrong.

I'll walk out alive. You'll be carried out, neck and below. Where they put the stake with your head on it Allah knows.

 

[SheriffJoe]

Doubtful either of us would walk out too healthy, dealing with these fanatical sickos. Look, I get it, to you only one of these sick groups is wrong. Reasonable folks KNOW they both are sick and need to be monitored, infiltrated, and stopped. If you want to continue debating it, fine, but you aren't going to change my mind, nor me yours. :toast:

 

[ScottL]

Doubtful either of us would walk out too healthy, dealing with these fanatical sickos. Look, I get it, to you only one of these sick groups is wrong. Reasonable folks KNOW they both are sick and need to be monitored, infiltrated, and stopped. If you want to continue debating it, fine, but you aren't going to change my mind, nor me yours. :toast:

No see, you don't. I never said both groups weren't a threat. Nor did I say Rightwing extremism isn't wrong. You are splashing words off my keyboard I never typed. I differentiated in a very easy to understand way why radical Islam is the bigger threat. If I could simplify it even more I'd say it's millions of minds with the same sick, nightmarish goal and vision. OTOH you could find 3 Rightwing whackos at random and while they may all be mindfucked, would disagree about many things. You're right about one thing - arguments about an issue shouldn't be continued when they go nowhere. But I don't see myself as wrong pointing out your adherence to easily debunked platitudes. The unabomber is not being replaced. Nor is he recruiting. David Koresh' compound burned down. That ended that. Vaporize Jihadi John from the sky and a dozen more race to replace him.

 

[The Guesser]

No see, you don't. I never said both groups weren't a threat. Nor did I say Rightwing extremism isn't wrong. You are splashing words off my keyboard I never typed. I differentiated in a very easy to understand way why radical Islam is the bigger threat. If I could simplify it even more I'd say it's millions of minds with the same sick, nightmarish goal and vision. OTOH you could find 3 Rightwing whackos at random and while they may all be mindfucked, would disagree about many things. You're right about one thing - arguments about an issue shouldn't be continued when they go nowhere. But I don't see myself as wrong pointing out your adherence to easily debunked platitudes. The unabomber is not being replaced. Nor is he recruiting. David Koresh' compound burned down. That ended that. Vaporize Jihadi John from the sky and a dozen more race to replace him.

As there are when one of these Extremist Anti Gov't sickos meets his fate. All I have is facts and numbers on my side about who is the bigger threat, as perceived by US Law Enforcement to an average, US Citizen. But I'm willing to say they are equal, sick threats that must be stopped. If you're not, and one MUST be greater than the other, than all we're debating is degrees of sickness.

 

[ScottL]

As there are when one of these Extremist Anti Gov't sickos meets his fate. All I have is facts and numbers on my side about who is the bigger threat, as perceived by US Law Enforcement to an average, US Citizen. But I'm willing to say they are equal, sick threats that must be stopped. If you're not, and one MUST be greater than the other, than all we're debating is degrees of sickness.

It's fine to stop here. Our stances are pretty clear.

 

[mountain]

No see, you don't. I never said both groups weren't a threat. Nor did I say Rightwing extremism isn't wrong. You are splashing words off my keyboard I never typed. I differentiated in a very easy to understand way why radical Islam is the bigger threat. If I could simplify it even more I'd say it's millions of minds with the same sick, nightmarish goal and vision. OTOH you could find 3 Rightwing whackos at random and while they may all be mindfucked, would disagree about many things. You're right about one thing - arguments about an issue shouldn't be continued when they go nowhere. But I don't see myself as wrong pointing out your adherence to easily debunked platitudes. The unabomber is not being replaced. Nor is he recruiting. David Koresh' compound burned down. That ended that. Vaporize Jihadi John from the sky and a dozen more race to replace him.

Sorry Scott, those words do not fit their narrative. These folks act as if the klan is still running rampant, hanging jews, blacks, gypsies and catholics. Morris Dees with The Southern Poverty Law Center sued the KKK into oblivion decades ago, liquidating all assets to pay off a judgement received by the family of one of their victims. No one is saying that these right wing extremists aren't in existence but to equally compare 2016 America to 2016 jihadi terror is an insult to all clear thinking individuals One old codger died in Oregon, good riddance. Number the victims of jihadists and right wing extremists since 1979 (when Iran first embarrassed our country) and the numbers are not even close.

 

[ScottL]

Yep.

 

[The Guesser]

Sorry Scott, those words do not fit their narrative. These folks act as if the klan is still running rampant, hanging jews, blacks, gypsies and catholics. Morris Dees with The Southern Poverty Law Center sued the KKK into oblivion decades ago, liquidating all assets to pay off a judgement received by the family of one of their victims. No one is saying that these right wing extremists aren't in existence but to equally compare 2016 America to 2016 jihadi terror is an insult to all clear thinking individuals One old codger died in Oregon, good riddance. Number the victims of jihadists and right wing extremists since 1979 (when Iran first embarrassed our country) and the numbers are not even close.

US Law enforcement disagrees with you. But, hey, what do they know compared to us experts safe behind our keyboards??

Kurzman and Schanzer also surveyed hundreds of law enforcement agencies regarding their assessment of various threats. Of the 382 agencies they spoke with, “74 percent reported anti-government extremism as one of the top three terrorist threats in their jurisdiction,” while only “39 percent listed extremism connected with Al Qaeda or like-minded terrorist organizations.”

 

[The Guesser]

The Growing Right-Wing Terror Threat

By CHARLES KURZMAN and DAVID SCHANZERJUNE 16, 2015


THIS month, the headlines were about a Muslim man in Boston who was accused of threatening police officers with a knife. Last month, two Muslims attacked an anti-Islamic conference in Garland, Tex. The month before, a Muslim man was charged with plotting to drive a truck bomb onto a military installation in Kansas. If you keep up with the news, you know that a small but steady stream of American Muslims, radicalized by overseas extremists, are engaging in violence here in the United States.
But headlines can mislead. The main terrorist threat in the United States is not from violent Muslim extremists, but from right-wing extremists. Just ask the police.
In a survey we conducted with the Police Executive Research Forum last year of 382 law enforcement agencies, 74 percent reported anti-government extremism as one of the top three terrorist threats in their jurisdiction; 39 percent listed extremism connected with Al Qaeda or like-minded terrorist organizations. And only 3 percent identified the threat from Muslim extremists as severe, compared with 7 percent for anti-government and other forms of extremism.
The self-proclaimed Islamic State’s efforts to radicalize American Muslims, which began just after the survey ended, may have increased threat perceptions somewhat, but not by much, as we found in follow-up interviews over the past year with counterterrorism specialists at 19 law enforcement agencies. These officers, selected from urban and rural areas around the country, said that radicalization from the Middle East was a concern, but not as dangerous as radicalization among right-wing extremists.
An officer from a large metropolitan area said that “militias, neo-Nazis and sovereign citizens” are the biggest threat we face in regard to extremism. One officer explained that he ranked the right-wing threat higher because “it is an emerging threat that we don’t have as good of a grip on, even with our intelligence unit, as we do with the Al Shabab/Al Qaeda issue, which we have been dealing with for some time.” An officer on the West Coast explained that the “sovereign citizen” anti-government threat has “really taken off,” whereas terrorism by American Muslim is something “we just haven’t experienced yet.”
Last year, for example, a man who identified with the sovereign citizen movement — which claims not to recognize the authority of federal or local government — attacked a courthouse in Forsyth County, Ga., firing an assault rifle at police officers and trying to cover his approach with tear gas and smoke grenades. The suspect was killed by the police, who returned fire. In Nevada, anti-government militants reportedly walked up to andshot two police officers at a restaurant, then placed a “Don’t tread on me” flag on their bodies. An anti-government extremist in Pennsylvania was arrested on suspicion of shooting two state troopers, killing one of them, before leading authorities on a 48-day manhunt. A right-wing militant in Texas declared a “revolution” and was arrested on suspicion of attempting to rob an armored car in order to buy weapons and explosives and attack law enforcement. These individuals on the fringes of right-wing politics increasingly worry law enforcement officials.
Law enforcement agencies around the country are training their officers to recognize signs of anti-government extremism and to exercise caution during routine traffic stops, criminal investigations and other interactions with potential extremists. “The threat is real,” says the handout from one training program sponsored by the Department of Justice. Since 2000, the handout notes, 25 law enforcement officers have been killed by right-wing extremists, who share a “fear that government will confiscate firearms” and a “belief in the approaching collapse of government and the economy.”
Despite public anxiety about extremists inspired by Al Qaeda and the Islamic State, the number of violent plots by such individuals has remainedvery low. Since 9/11, an average of nine American Muslims per year have been involved in an average of six terrorism-related plots against targets in the United States. Most were disrupted, but the 20 plots that were carried out accounted for 50 fatalities over the past 13 and a half years.

In contrast, right-wing extremists averaged 337 attacks per year in the decade after 9/11, causing a total of 254 fatalities, according to a study by Arie Perliger, a professor at the United States Military Academy’sCombating Terrorism Center. The toll has increased since the study was released in 2012.
Other data sets, using different definitions of political violence, tell comparable stories. The Global Terrorism Database maintained by theStart Center at the University of Maryland includes 65 attacks in the United States associated with right-wing ideologies and 24 by Muslim extremists since 9/11. The International Security Program at the New America Foundation identifies 39 fatalities from “non-jihadist” homegrown extremists and 26 fatalities from “jihadist” extremists.
Meanwhile, terrorism of all forms has accounted for a tiny proportion of violence in America. There have been more than 215,000 murders in the United States since 9/11. For every person killed by Muslim extremists, there have been 4,300 homicides from other threats.
Public debates on terrorism focus intensely on Muslims. But this focus does not square with the low number of plots in the United States by Muslims, and it does a disservice to a minority group that suffers from increasingly hostile public opinion. As state and local police agencies remind us, right-wing, anti-government extremism is the leading source of ideological violence in America.

Correction: June 19, 2015
An Op-Ed article on Tuesday omitted the given name of a scholar of counterterrorism at West Point. He is Arie Perliger.
​

 

[mountain]

US Law enforcement disagrees with you. But, hey, what do they know compared to us experts safe behind our keyboards??

Kurzman and Schanzer also surveyed hundreds of law enforcement agencies regarding their assessment of various threats. Of the 382 agencies they spoke with, “74 percent reported anti-government extremism as one of the top three terrorist threats in their jurisdiction,” while only “39 percent listed extremism connected with Al Qaeda or like-minded terrorist organizations.”

Kurzman and Schanzer...great.

Just from a pure numbers standpoint do you honestly believe that over the past 35 years that there are more victims of right wing extremism or Islamic extremism? A 15 minute google search will give you the answer but here is a hint: more people were killed by El Qaeda on one day than 35 years of right wing extremist murders.

But hey, what do the families of 3,000 people killed in one day know while they cry behind their keyboard.

I can provide you with actual numbers but hey, if you want to believe the Kurzman whatever report generated by our government, have at it, I thought you were a little more open minded.