Boxslayer's CFB Week 12 (45-28, +24.05 units, 62%)

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Box - That was an excellent post. It is amazing how many people fail to recognize that successful sports betting is primarily based on probabilities and expected value. The concept of variance seems to be ignored.
 

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box - that post is why i read this forum and why i read your threads..thanks for contributing
 

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sportsfan - i'll have everything up by the weekend. Kudos for taking those kids out there. Those are great experiences for young guys, they should have a blast.

kdub - thanks and GL to you

Pipestew - you hit the nail on the head.

shoboy - i always cringe once my posts start getting lengthy. i realize i make a lot of lengthy posts. once these fingers get rolling, i cant stop and feel like i havent gotten my point across. it makes it worthwhile to know the posts are appreciated and people can gain something from them - for better or wose. GL

delta - thanks and GL this weekend
 

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Box - That was an excellent post. It is amazing how many people fail to recognize that successful sports betting is primarily based on probabilities and expected value. The concept of variance seems to be ignored.


What???
So picking 100% winners isn't likely????

So true, as I read somewhere...in the end capping sports is really just guessing the winner but those that are successful make much more educated "guesses". The idea is to use all information available to give yourself the best percentage chance of being right.
 

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<table x:str="" style="border-collapse: collapse; width: 371pt;" width="493" border="0" cellpadding="0" cellspacing="0"><col style="width: 105pt;" width="140"> <col style="width: 109pt;" width="145"> <col style="width: 80pt;" width="106"> <col style="width: 77pt;" width="102"> <tbody><tr style="height: 12.75pt;" height="17"> <td class="xl24" style="height: 12.75pt; width: 105pt;" width="140" height="17">Category</td> <td class="xl24" style="width: 109pt;" width="145">Description</td> <td class="xl24" style="width: 80pt;" width="106">PT Margin</td> <td class="xl24" style="width: 77pt;" width="102">Win Margin</td> </tr> <tr style="height: 12.75pt;" height="17"> <td class="xl24" style="height: 12.75pt;" height="17">Converting</td> <td class="xl24">3rd Down % Off</td> <td class="xl24" x:num="">2.76</td> <td class="xl24" x:num="">0.61</td> </tr> <tr style="height: 12.75pt;" height="17"> <td class="xl24" style="height: 12.75pt;" height="17">Pass OFF</td> <td class="xl24">YPG</td> <td class="xl25" x:num="">2.52</td> <td class="xl24" x:num="">0.61</td> </tr> <tr style="height: 12.75pt;" height="17"> <td class="xl24" style="height: 12.75pt;" height="17">Converting</td> <td class="xl24">1st Downs/Gm</td> <td class="xl24" x:num="">3.33</td> <td class="xl24" x:num="">0.53</td> </tr> <tr style="height: 12.75pt;" height="17"> <td class="xl24" style="height: 12.75pt;" height="17">Pass OFF</td> <td class="xl24">YPC</td> <td class="xl25" x:num="">2.76</td> <td class="xl24" x:num="">0.49</td> </tr> <tr style="height: 12.75pt;" height="17"> <td class="xl24" style="height: 12.75pt;" height="17">Rush DEF</td> <td class="xl24">YPC</td> <td class="xl25" x:num="">1.90</td> <td class="xl24" x:num="">0.49</td> </tr> <tr style="height: 12.75pt;" height="17"> <td class="xl24" style="height: 12.75pt;" height="17">Rush DEF</td> <td class="xl24">YPG</td> <td class="xl25" x:num="">1.41</td> <td class="xl24" x:num="">0.49</td> </tr> <tr style="height: 12.75pt;" height="17"> <td class="xl24" style="height: 12.75pt;" height="17">Converting</td> <td class="xl24">1st DWn DEF</td> <td class="xl25" x:num="">1.77</td> <td class="xl24" x:num="">0.45</td> </tr> <tr style="height: 12.75pt;" height="17"> <td class="xl24" style="height: 12.75pt;" height="17">Converting</td> <td class="xl24">Sacks</td> <td class="xl25" x:num="">0.78</td> <td class="xl24" x:num="">0.43</td> </tr> <tr style="height: 12.75pt;" height="17"> <td class="xl24" style="height: 12.75pt;" height="17">Turn and Pen</td> <td class="xl24">TO Margin</td> <td class="xl25" x:num="">2.22</td> <td class="xl24" x:num="">0.43</td> </tr> <tr style="height: 12.75pt;" height="17"> <td class="xl24" style="height: 12.75pt;" height="17">Red Zone DEF</td> <td class="xl24">Percent</td> <td class="xl25" x:num="">1.84</td> <td class="xl24" x:num="">0.37</td> </tr> <tr style="height: 12.75pt;" height="17"> <td class="xl24" style="height: 12.75pt;" height="17">Red Zone OFF</td> <td class="xl24">Pts/Drive</td> <td class="xl25" x:num="">2.26</td> <td class="xl24" x:num="">0.37</td> </tr> <tr style="height: 12.75pt;" height="17"> <td class="xl24" style="height: 12.75pt;" height="17">Pass DEF</td> <td class="xl24">YPC</td> <td class="xl25" x:num="">2.06</td> <td class="xl24" x:num="">0.35</td> </tr> <tr style="height: 12.75pt;" height="17"> <td class="xl24" style="height: 12.75pt;" height="17">Converting</td> <td class="xl24">3rd % DEF</td> <td class="xl25" x:num="">1.76</td> <td class="xl24" x:num="">0.31</td> </tr> <tr style="height: 12.75pt;" height="17"> <td class="xl24" style="height: 12.75pt;" height="17">Pass DEF</td> <td class="xl24">Comp %</td> <td class="xl25" x:num="">1.21</td> <td class="xl24" x:num="">0.29</td> </tr> <tr style="height: 12.75pt;" height="17"> <td class="xl24" style="height: 12.75pt;" height="17">Rush OFF</td> <td class="xl24">YPC</td> <td class="xl25" x:num="">1.95</td> <td class="xl24" x:num="">0.29</td> </tr> <tr style="height: 12.75pt;" height="17"> <td class="xl24" style="height: 12.75pt;" height="17">Turn and Pen</td> <td class="xl24">Pen/Gm</td> <td class="xl25" x:num="">1.94</td> <td class="xl24" x:num="">0.27</td> </tr> <tr style="height: 12.75pt;" height="17"> <td class="xl24" style="height: 12.75pt;" height="17">Pass OFF</td> <td class="xl24">Comp %</td> <td class="xl25" x:num="">0.60</td> <td class="xl24" x:num="">0.25</td> </tr> <tr style="height: 12.75pt;" height="17"> <td class="xl24" style="height: 12.75pt;" height="17">Rush OFF</td> <td class="xl24">YPG</td> <td class="xl25" x:num="">1.21</td> <td class="xl24" x:num="">0.21</td> </tr> <tr style="height: 12.75pt;" height="17"> <td class="xl24" style="height: 12.75pt;" height="17">Turn and Pen</td> <td class="xl24">Pen Yards/Gm</td> <td class="xl25" x:num="">1.20</td> <td class="xl24" x:num="">0.19</td> </tr> <tr style="height: 12.75pt;" height="17"> <td class="xl24" style="height: 12.75pt;" height="17">Pass DEF</td> <td class="xl24">YPG</td> <td class="xl25" x:num="">1.40</td> <td class="xl24" x:num="">0.17</td> </tr> </tbody></table>


Other interpretations from this chart:

1. Offensively: Passing offense has more of an outcome on a game than rushing offense - both on the scoreboard and the win column.
2. Defensively: Rushing defense Yards per carry is more important than yards per game.
3. Passing offense, 1st downs/game and converting 3rd downs all have more impact on a game than turnover margin.
4. Yards per catch/yards per pass is the most important statistic of passing defense when determining points allowed and wins.
5. Sacks play a big part of winning football games, but dont have a big impact on the scoreboard. Interpretation: Teams that sack that QB have a good chance of winning, but doesnt necessarily effect the over/under.
 

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Thank you very much for the data you provide, boxslayer. You've been succssful for a long time. I root for you every week. Keep it up buddy.
:toast:
 

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Jerry dont take this post personally. I'm going to give this an effort to show you what I am trying to say. This is the long post I was trying to avoid making, but clearly you arent understanding.

I am very well aware what my writeup said on the game. I don't need it copied and pasted. I am not bitter in the least bit. My eyes do not need to be opened. I am not talking about Minnesota or Michigan. I am talking about handicapping principles. It has nothing to do with being stubborn from the game. I have lost a million 5* plays before.

I am talking about the manner in which you handicap your games. I have a certain procedure that I go through, and a method for determining how many units (*) I put on games. I put myself in high percentage situations. I am very successful at this because I pick my games based on a certain criteria, and that criteria doesn't steer me wrong. I don't stray from how I do things. And if you find an approach you like, you shouldn't either.

You are trying to make this out to be a Minnesota vs. Michigan thing and get into some kind of discussion about the teams and why Minnesota was the wrong side. I get it. You think that I need to adjust after the clear loss. I get it. I am trying to say Minnesota is the right side because it fell into every concept I use to handicap games. I dont give a rats ass what happened on the field. I didnt even watch the game. I dont care if Michigan won 100-0, and Minnesota ddnt gain a yard. I dont care if Minnesota looked so horrible, that they get their D1 ranking stripped from them. My point is not about talent, matchups, trends, and value.

My point is simply to say how Vegas continues to make money. My main point, is one bad weekend, or two bad weekends can put so much cloud of doubt in many peoples minds that they start to adjust their views on a team, how they do things, they start flip flopping, they start changing, they start looking at some stupid short term trend they noticed to make their decisions, they start looking at too much information, they start pressing, they start thinking a team is better or worse than what they really are, they have knee jerk reactions to blowout losses especially...etc.

People that have been successful doing things for a long time, can even question how they came to a certain play or plays. Once that doubt enters your mind about how you are going about things.... you are done. You dont know which way is sharp, and which is square, what is the winning side or losing side. You might as well flip a coin.

Minnesota was the right side in that game. NOT BECAUSE they should have won. Not because I took a bad beat. Not because they were the better team. Not because they caught a bad break. Not because of refereeing. Not because of a fix. Not because of any of that.

But because I have hit 62% over 3 years using a certain set of handicapping principles, a certain set of criteria to identify games and then determine how much to play them for. When a lot of things fall in the line, the play becomes a 3* or more, and when just about everything that I use to cap a game falls in line it becomes a 5* play or more. On those types of plays, I hit at an outstanding rate. Keyword rate. Everything can lose, and can look really bad doing so in the process. I get it. Minnesota got dominated. Michigan was easily the better team on Saturday.

Minnesota got dominated by Michigan. DOMINATED. No excuses. But I am of firm belief that if you play a game 10 times, the underdog will always blow the favorite out one of those games when the spread is within 10 points or less especially.

Every game is a set of random events.

You think my eyes need to be opened because Minnesota got dominated whistle to whistle and I still think I was on the right side. What is this guy thinking? I get it.

My point is, it is my firm belief that you are wrong. It's not bitterness. Its consistency.

When I start hitting 52%, I'll start reevaluating the way I cap games and make adjustments.

But my exact point of writing what I wrote last week, and now continuing to write what I am writing now, is for the guys out there just like you. You want to take one loss, one week, one bad game, and reevaluate your view on a team. Or your way of capping the game. Or your decision to make the play. Or open someone's eyes.

That is WRONG. THAT is why Vegas wins. And that was my entire point to writing what I wrote.

Every single play I made last week was the right side. Actually there was one play, Duke, that was capped incorrectly. Every single play I have made this year was the right side except for a couple. Most of my losses were the right side. Not because they should have covered, or I took a bad beat. But because I capped them the way I always have and everything fell in line the way things always have over my last 300 plays at 62%.

I dont just look at the card and start picking games that standout to me. That is like throwing darts. I dont just think about teams strengths and weaknesses. There is an approach to every single game that I take that is very consistent.

I understand. You think I'm nuts. You think I was clearly on the wrong side on most of my losses. You think I'm being stubborn. I get it.

Now let's see if you get what I'm saying....

In the world of college football....1 loss can change a season for a team. It can send you from National Title game to the Outback Bowl. And college football more so than any other sport, has the most over-reactive bettors than any other sport. College football bettors get caught up in losses more than anyone. It's the only sport where a team can lose one game and everyone starts calling them a fraud. Can you believe that? 1 freaking game and the team is a fraud? Laughable.

People think Penn State sucks right now. Fraud. People thought Florida was a fraud when they lost to Ole Miss. Now people can't get off their nuts.

That's not how you bet, and that's not the kind of mindset that wins.

Don't get me wrong, I always look at a loss and see what I could have done to cap it better. I always learn from the losses.

But I don't stray from what I do. The Minnesota game was handled and capped with the same approach that I have done for every single game. It wasn't a 5* because I just felt like putting 5 units on it or I felt really good about it. The approach dictated it was a 5*.

The approach has hit 62% over 300 plays. It was the correct way to cap it, it was the correct side. I'll play it again just like I did tomorrow.

I am not going to alter the way I have capped 62% winners over 300 plays because Minnesota got blown out. I am not going to start messing with the numbers on my excel sheet and drop their ass and move Michigan up. I am not going to change my approach because of the game or the weekend.

Because THAT is why Vegas wins. You can't keep overreacting, adjusting, and completely change your thoughts on teams week to week and change the way you cap.
box,i fully understand you're not going to admit you were wrong about the game and that is fine...we see what we want to see...but,and this is a big but,dont try and convince me that you believe minnesota was the right side....i've thorougly enjoyed our little conversation and hope you dont get too bent out of shape...just watched n illinois tie it up and i've got em -3
 

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box,i fully understand you're not going to admit you were wrong about the game and that is fine...we see what we want to see...but,and this is a big but,dont try and convince me that you believe minnesota was the right side....i've thorougly enjoyed our little conversation and hope you dont get too bent out of shape...just watched n illinois tie it up and i've got em -3

You're hopeless.
 

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I dont know why people are so critical on how boxy backs up his plays. You have choices of your own..either contribute with insights or get the f*ck out of his threads. nuff said. good job boxy keep it up..gl
 

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box,i fully understand you're not going to admit you were wrong about the game and that is fine...we see what we want to see...but,and this is a big but,dont try and convince me that you believe minnesota was the right side....i've thorougly enjoyed our little conversation and hope you dont get too bent out of shape...just watched n illinois tie it up and i've got em -3

either you can't read or your a 14 yr old high school girl . holy fuck
 

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Lol...this is some good stuff...thanks for the info box...jerry, you must have lost a ton of money on this game or else you wouldnt be on boxy's dick like this....
 

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Looking forward to tonight Box...Thanks for all the hard work!
 

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Jerry dont take this post personally. I'm going to give this an effort to show you what I am trying to say. This is the long post I was trying to avoid making, but clearly you arent understanding.

I am very well aware what my writeup said on the game. I don't need it copied and pasted. I am not bitter in the least bit. My eyes do not need to be opened. I am not talking about Minnesota or Michigan. I am talking about handicapping principles. It has nothing to do with being stubborn from the game. I have lost a million 5* plays before.

I am talking about the manner in which you handicap your games. I have a certain procedure that I go through, and a method for determining how many units (*) I put on games. I put myself in high percentage situations. I am very successful at this because I pick my games based on a certain criteria, and that criteria doesn't steer me wrong. I don't stray from how I do things. And if you find an approach you like, you shouldn't either.

You are trying to make this out to be a Minnesota vs. Michigan thing and get into some kind of discussion about the teams and why Minnesota was the wrong side. I get it. You think that I need to adjust after the clear loss. I get it. I am trying to say Minnesota is the right side because it fell into every concept I use to handicap games. I dont give a rats ass what happened on the field. I didnt even watch the game. I dont care if Michigan won 100-0, and Minnesota ddnt gain a yard. I dont care if Minnesota looked so horrible, that they get their D1 ranking stripped from them. My point is not about talent, matchups, trends, and value.

My point is simply to say how Vegas continues to make money. My main point, is one bad weekend, or two bad weekends can put so much cloud of doubt in many peoples minds that they start to adjust their views on a team, how they do things, they start flip flopping, they start changing, they start looking at some stupid short term trend they noticed to make their decisions, they start looking at too much information, they start pressing, they start thinking a team is better or worse than what they really are, they have knee jerk reactions to blowout losses especially...etc.

People that have been successful doing things for a long time, can even question how they came to a certain play or plays. Once that doubt enters your mind about how you are going about things.... you are done. You dont know which way is sharp, and which is square, what is the winning side or losing side. You might as well flip a coin.

Minnesota was the right side in that game. NOT BECAUSE they should have won. Not because I took a bad beat. Not because they were the better team. Not because they caught a bad break. Not because of refereeing. Not because of a fix. Not because of any of that.

But because I have hit 62% over 3 years using a certain set of handicapping principles, a certain set of criteria to identify games and then determine how much to play them for. When a lot of things fall in the line, the play becomes a 3* or more, and when just about everything that I use to cap a game falls in line it becomes a 5* play or more. On those types of plays, I hit at an outstanding rate. Keyword rate. Everything can lose, and can look really bad doing so in the process. I get it. Minnesota got dominated. Michigan was easily the better team on Saturday.

Minnesota got dominated by Michigan. DOMINATED. No excuses. But I am of firm belief that if you play a game 10 times, the underdog will always blow the favorite out one of those games when the spread is within 10 points or less especially.

Every game is a set of random events.

You think my eyes need to be opened because Minnesota got dominated whistle to whistle and I still think I was on the right side. What is this guy thinking? I get it.

My point is, it is my firm belief that you are wrong. It's not bitterness. Its consistency.

When I start hitting 52%, I'll start reevaluating the way I cap games and make adjustments.

But my exact point of writing what I wrote last week, and now continuing to write what I am writing now, is for the guys out there just like you. You want to take one loss, one week, one bad game, and reevaluate your view on a team. Or your way of capping the game. Or your decision to make the play. Or open someone's eyes.

That is WRONG. THAT is why Vegas wins. And that was my entire point to writing what I wrote.

Every single play I made last week was the right side. Actually there was one play, Duke, that was capped incorrectly. Every single play I have made this year was the right side except for a couple. Most of my losses were the right side. Not because they should have covered, or I took a bad beat. But because I capped them the way I always have and everything fell in line the way things always have over my last 300 plays at 62%.

I dont just look at the card and start picking games that standout to me. That is like throwing darts. I dont just think about teams strengths and weaknesses. There is an approach to every single game that I take that is very consistent.

I understand. You think I'm nuts. You think I was clearly on the wrong side on most of my losses. You think I'm being stubborn. I get it.

Now let's see if you get what I'm saying....

In the world of college football....1 loss can change a season for a team. It can send you from National Title game to the Outback Bowl. And college football more so than any other sport, has the most over-reactive bettors than any other sport. College football bettors get caught up in losses more than anyone. It's the only sport where a team can lose one game and everyone starts calling them a fraud. Can you believe that? 1 freaking game and the team is a fraud? Laughable.

People think Penn State sucks right now. Fraud. People thought Florida was a fraud when they lost to Ole Miss. Now people can't get off their nuts.

That's not how you bet, and that's not the kind of mindset that wins.

Don't get me wrong, I always look at a loss and see what I could have done to cap it better. I always learn from the losses.

But I don't stray from what I do. The Minnesota game was handled and capped with the same approach that I have done for every single game. It wasn't a 5* because I just felt like putting 5 units on it or I felt really good about it. The approach dictated it was a 5*.

The approach has hit 62% over 300 plays. It was the correct way to cap it, it was the correct side. I'll play it again just like I did tomorrow.

I am not going to alter the way I have capped 62% winners over 300 plays because Minnesota got blown out. I am not going to start messing with the numbers on my excel sheet and drop their ass and move Michigan up. I am not going to change my approach because of the game or the weekend.

Because THAT is why Vegas wins. You can't keep overreacting, adjusting, and completely change your thoughts on teams week to week and change the way you cap.


Do not say much here on therx....but this is one HELL of an outstanding post by Box.

The hardest thing to do here is to stick your neck out put an opinion on the therx--since 'cappers probably spend too much responding to inane comments. The easiest thing to do is tear somebody down with little in terms of substance to argue their opinion.

Funny thing is as I do not see jerrytheknife sticking his neck out and adding value in providing picks in any of his recent posts.
 

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Box-
Using your analysis of the chart for the Buffalo and Akron game... Buffalo has the advantages on 11 categories and Akron is favored in 8 of the categories and with one category being tied. Which mean Buffalo has a better chance of winning and cover the spread against Akron. You also had Buffalo ranked higher than Akron.

If I was to use the criterias above, then the lean would be BUFFALO tonight. I think I will place a wager on Buffalo +3.

Thanks
 

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2* Buffalo Bulls +3 -110

3rd straight week wagering on Buffalo as it continues that the books undervalue the Bulls and Drew Willy.

My line Buffalo -3.

Buffalo is the better team, getting points. They have played the tougher schedule to date. They have the better passing attack, they convert more 3rd downs, they make the plays when it counts. They are a great road team, 6-0 ATS last 6 games on the road.

Akron is a solid team, but they are outmatched here. They have not done well at home, and I was on them at home last week where they covered. That was their first home win of the season. But don't overvalue homefield here and don't overvalue motivational angles.

Both teams battling for first place in the MAC. Both teams will give their best efforts. No let downs are flat teams here. It comes down to who the better team is and that is Buffalo.

Drew Willy has come into his own at QB. He continues to make plays and in these types of games that project to be slugfests, take the QB that can make more plays. Drew Willy is that guy.

Take the better team getting points that can move the football consistently and convert with their seasoned QB.

Buffalo 31
Akron 28
 

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