Are you really trying to compare Dale Murphy to Jimmy Rollins ? Rollins had 150 HR and Murphy had 398 ! Murphy had 7 years in which his slugging percentage was over .500. Rollins had only 1 and that was in his MVP year. Murphy had 9 seasons in which his OPS was over .800 of which 4 were over .900 including a .997. Rollins had no seasons with a OPS over .900 and only 3 with a OPS percentage over .800. Also Murphy played baseball for 18 years and most of his stats were compiled in the late 70's and 80's. He suffered a lot of injuries and really didn't do much in the 90's at all. This was a very non steroid period and We can be pretty certain that Murphy did his stats the honest way. I think because of all the inflated stats that were generated during the steroid period in baseball, Guys like Dale Murphy should be given some credit. No doubt some of Murphy's injuries might have gone far better if He had been on HGH and steroids like a bunch of the clowns that followed him.
GABRH2B3BHRGSRBIBBSOSHSFAVGOBPSLG2,4998,7561,2762,3564214737651,3308491,3862679.269.341.457
GABRH2B3BHRGSRBIBBSOSHSFAVGOBPSLG2,4568,6801,0742,4724834724891,38985569411100.285.348.437
Gotta say the Ted Simmons argument is valid based on stats. You can throw in Bench and Berra as well among others but listed above is Fisk, then Simmons. Fisk's edge is in Runs and Home runs but Simmons picks up the slack in hits as well as RBIs. Also, note that Simmons struck out HALF as much.
Honestly if you based everything just on stats, he should be in. Then again so should Rose but reality is such that other variables play into who gets into the hall. I mean that is life folks. Personality, cooperation with the media, gambling, etc. All of these go into it. The HOF voters are human beings with thoughts, feelings and biases.
GABRH2B3BHRGSRBIBBSOSHSFAVGOBPSLG2,4568,6801,0742,4724834724891,38985569411100.285.348.437
Gotta say the Ted Simmons argument is valid based on stats. You can throw in Bench and Berra as well among others but listed above is Fisk, then Simmons. Fisk's edge is in Runs and Home runs but Simmons picks up the slack in hits as well as RBIs. Also, note that Simmons struck out HALF as much.
Honestly if you based everything just on stats, he should be in. Then again so should Rose but reality is such that other variables play into who gets into the hall. I mean that is life folks. Personality, cooperation with the media, gambling, etc. All of these go into it. The HOF voters are human beings with thoughts, feelings and biases.
Blyleven of the more recent eligibles should be inducted.
3 that never made it should be in there. 1) Joe Wood, short career similar to Koufax & Dizzy Dean in both brevity and excellence. Joe Wood was 34-5 in 1912 & the Sox won the pennent. Joe Wood was 3-1 in the World Series leading the Sox to the championship. Fielding a bunt the next year he broke his thumb and though maintaining a winning record & low ERA his prime as a pitcher was over. He sat
out the 1916 & 1917 season, but ulike Koufax he was a suburb hitter and came back as such. In 1918 he led his new team Cleveland in HomeRuns. Joe Wood is a Hall of Fame Ballplayer
2) Junior Stephens
3 that never made it should be in there. 1) Joe Wood, short career similar to Koufax & Dizzy Dean in both brevity and excellence. Joe Wood was 34-5 in 1912 & the Sox won the pennent. Joe Wood was 3-1 in the World Series leading the Sox to the championship. Fielding a bunt the next year he broke his thumb and though maintaining a winning record & low ERA his prime as a pitcher was over. He sat
out the 1916 & 1917 season, but ulike Koufax he was a suburb hitter and came back as such. In 1918 he led his new team Cleveland in HomeRuns. Joe Wood is a Hall of Fame Ballplayer
2) Junior Stephens
2) Junior Stephens 2 reasons he never made it after 10 nice years, he was hurt in 1951 and was never the same again & he died very young & was kinda forgotten. Stephens accomplished 3 things no one else ever did. As a shortstop he in the early 40's hit more HR's than all the other shortstop in both leagues combined I think it was 1943! Some say Mel Ott did the same in the 30's as a 3rd Basemen for the Giants but Ott played some games in the OF so thats disputed.
Also since WWII no player not even during the steroid era has ever had more RBI's in 3 consecutive years as Stephens, not Williams, not Aaron, not Mays not even Manny or Sosa during the Steroid era.
Finally in 1949 he broke the HR record for a SS and still has the SS RBI record. Junior Stepehens also led the Browns into their only World Series.
Also since WWII no player not even during the steroid era has ever had more RBI's in 3 consecutive years as Stephens, not Williams, not Aaron, not Mays not even Manny or Sosa during the Steroid era.
Finally in 1949 he broke the HR record for a SS and still has the SS RBI record. Junior Stepehens also led the Browns into their only World Series.
You should reread my post as well as billhill999 post. Where do you come up with your " not just one or two " quote ? 2 MVP's and a total of 9 pretty awesome seasons with OPS all over .800 and 4 over .900 equals one or 2 good seasons ? I'm glad you will never serve on a jury ! You only read and see what you think and write ! Keep smoking !
Thanks for telling me what I do but I read every word you typed and you actually thought I was comparing Jimmy Rollins to Dale Murphy LOLOLOLOL. I was comparing them each winning MVP awards not comparing their play but I'm the one reading what I want.
My entire point was a guy posted earlier that Dale should be in because he won two MVP awards and my point is a career is much more than 2 MVP awards...obviously that poster doesn't understand that concept. Should Dale Murphy be in? Yeah, maybe but so should a handful of others with better numbers as well.
Well now We're getting a little bit closer. I read Yeah and I have already agreed that Rice and Belle belong in the HOF also. The HOF is full of players that have never won 2 MVP titles and I would guess they are players in the Hall that have never won any ! Check it out for me OK ? it's no small accomplishment IMHO.
Bert Blyleven
Pete Rose doesn't count IMHO, he's banned
287-250, 60 of his wins were shutouts. He always played on bad teams
3701 K's
3.31 ERA
1.19 WHIP
man was a workhorse, not a modern day "quality start" specialist.
threw over 275 innings 6 straight seasons
over 200 innings 17 seasons
used to throw 140 pitchers per game in a FOUR MAN ROTATION
he would have 350+ wins if he played for competitive teams
his ERA and WHIP would be off the charts if he threw 7 innings on 4 days rest.
you still can't find a better pitcher not in the HOF
Pete Rose doesn't count IMHO, he's banned
287-250, 60 of his wins were shutouts. He always played on bad teams
3701 K's
3.31 ERA
1.19 WHIP
man was a workhorse, not a modern day "quality start" specialist.
threw over 275 innings 6 straight seasons
over 200 innings 17 seasons
used to throw 140 pitchers per game in a FOUR MAN ROTATION
he would have 350+ wins if he played for competitive teams
his ERA and WHIP would be off the charts if he threw 7 innings on 4 days rest.
you still can't find a better pitcher not in the HOF
There are only 2 players who have won 2 MVP's and are not in the Hall of fame. Roger Maris and Dale Murphy. Maris gets my vote also more so for his impact on History than his lifetime stats. He didn't excell for all that many years and that's why his stats aren't all that impressive.
Always stupid to discuss topics from eight years ago, just can't help myself
Murphy's 82 and 83 were no better than Fred Lynn's 75 and 79. Overall MVP voting ok criteria, but the sports writers are too stupid to use as an absolute barometer.
Murphy had seven very good years and very little else. Overall he and Lynn and Reggie Smith and Minnie Minoso and Dwight Evans are all better than Rice and at least equals to Dawson. I much prefer higher standards for the Hall-of-Fame, so only the very best of that group, Dwight Evans should even deserve consideration, who played in 2 600 games and had an OPS+ better than all but Rice (128 to 127 and Rice is by far the worst defensively of that group)
But even Evans probably wasn't as good as Raines who only earns 30% of the vote
Not sure Raines exceeds Santo, Allen and Blyleven
Of course, of eligible players, McGwire is the only correct choice. Perhaps sports writers should use their votes as a chance to fight the war on drugs and keep him out. The only question is why they elected a couple other drug users only a few years earlier
To me, Maris is a good choice if only for the "fame" aspect and not for being an all-time great player
Murphy's 82 and 83 were no better than Fred Lynn's 75 and 79. Overall MVP voting ok criteria, but the sports writers are too stupid to use as an absolute barometer.
Murphy had seven very good years and very little else. Overall he and Lynn and Reggie Smith and Minnie Minoso and Dwight Evans are all better than Rice and at least equals to Dawson. I much prefer higher standards for the Hall-of-Fame, so only the very best of that group, Dwight Evans should even deserve consideration, who played in 2 600 games and had an OPS+ better than all but Rice (128 to 127 and Rice is by far the worst defensively of that group)
But even Evans probably wasn't as good as Raines who only earns 30% of the vote
Not sure Raines exceeds Santo, Allen and Blyleven
Of course, of eligible players, McGwire is the only correct choice. Perhaps sports writers should use their votes as a chance to fight the war on drugs and keep him out. The only question is why they elected a couple other drug users only a few years earlier
To me, Maris is a good choice if only for the "fame" aspect and not for being an all-time great player
Also, Juan Gonzalez has two MVP awards. Not sure if he has been on the ballot yet
Alomar and Larkin are two others better than the Rice/Dawson standard
For the first 60 to 70 years the writers maintained very consistent and high standards. Only missing a couple of truly deserving players (Mize, Vaughan, etc.) only electing a few truly undeserving (Hunter). Now in the past 10 years they have put in Dawson, Rice, Gossage, Sutter and Perez, while ignoring all those listed above who are better than every one of those five
Alomar and Larkin are two others better than the Rice/Dawson standard
For the first 60 to 70 years the writers maintained very consistent and high standards. Only missing a couple of truly deserving players (Mize, Vaughan, etc.) only electing a few truly undeserving (Hunter). Now in the past 10 years they have put in Dawson, Rice, Gossage, Sutter and Perez, while ignoring all those listed above who are better than every one of those five
Well said....I watched Murphy throughout the 80's and the guy was the real deal.....awesome power. great glove, hustle.....just an awesome player and a great team guy. HOF worthy imo. Great player for an entire decade. Guy would have hit 60 Home Runs 5 straight years if he were on roids and playing in the launching pad in atlanta. The kind of player who did something great every night. Very underrated because of pre roid stats which are not AROD like. Look at AROD without the juice.....guy may not hit 30 home runs.
