a settlement will mean they won't get the 16 bil they are asking for most likely
don't see how the common's get much of anything out of this after the dust settles but maybe i'm wrong
will be interesting to watch
GL
how many PQs and KQs are out there?
plus i'm guessing there is bondholder issues in the mix too that will get paid before common's as well
Sorry guys, there's way too many numbers running around my head right now. All i know is, JPM offered WaMu $8/share in July, and WaMu turned it down. If they're going to get a settlement, then it's going to be greater than $8/share IMHO. And yes, $8/share for the commons, Preferreds and Capital Trusts will be paid in full. Not sure how many O/S there are for WAMPQ & WAMKQ right now, I'll try to check later and post on the forum.
From the Yahoo board (with credit to Bopfan)...
"Absolute priority requires that the debt and preferreds be unimpaired (i.e., put in the position they would have been in had the seizure not occurred). Accordingly, there can be no payment to commons until past dividends are repaid. Since no cash will change hands that means additional shares will be issued."
"You MUST follow the APR rule if there are sufficient funds. A mere $5 billion is enough to make the debt and preferreds whole, and my reading of the MOR suggests WMI already has that much (I've said before I think A has been artificially suppressed). Those two classes could be paid off with nothing for commons. That won't happen because of the lawsuits. That WMI would recover through pre-litigation negotiation or a lawsuit was obvious to me from the beginning, hence my involvement with this board, so no deal reducing preferreds' or debts' shares will be cut. There will be recovery down to the commons, but the senior classes will get fully compensated."
"Absolute priority requires that the debt and preferreds be unimpaired (i.e., put in the position they would have been in had the seizure not occurred). Accordingly, there can be no payment to commons until past dividends are repaid. Since no cash will change hands that means additional shares will be issued."
"You MUST follow the APR rule if there are sufficient funds. A mere $5 billion is enough to make the debt and preferreds whole, and my reading of the MOR suggests WMI already has that much (I've said before I think A has been artificially suppressed). Those two classes could be paid off with nothing for commons. That won't happen because of the lawsuits. That WMI would recover through pre-litigation negotiation or a lawsuit was obvious to me from the beginning, hence my involvement with this board, so no deal reducing preferreds' or debts' shares will be cut. There will be recovery down to the commons, but the senior classes will get fully compensated."
Spoken like a true genius, who posted that?? I need to boardmark that person, lol. Anyway, WAMUQ is getting paid because TPG has an insane amount invested as well as the Chinese.
There are only 3M WAMPQs outstanding. Still researching the WAMKQs, but not as much information on these, I think they only have a $25 face value whereas the PQs have a $1000 face value I believe, still waiting on confirmation of this as well. Either way, TPG gets paid, WAMUQ gets paid, everyone is happy.
As a novice I need to ask a question. If the "short sellers" are buying shares to cover their tickets, what happens when their ticket gets "punched". What I am asking is this.... If the shorts are buying now which pushes up the price, what happens when they are covered? Will there be a selloff by the guy left holding the bag?
I be reel konphuzed hear bossman. All these numbers be hurtin my pheeble mind......
I be reel konphuzed hear bossman. All these numbers be hurtin my pheeble mind......
Four big players that will keep this from being swept under the rug....
1) the Chinese got screwed over
2) David Bonderman got screwed over
3) TPG got screwed over
4) Deutsch Bank got screwed over
JPM and the FDIC should have done their own DD to see who was involved and who they were screwing over before they did it.
No, there's very little chance of those shares getting dumped back onto the market IMO. This is because of two reasons:
1) when you short a stock, you used borrowed stock that you eventually have to return to the original owner of that stock. So, people short a stock with the assumption they'll be able to buy it at a lower price, and return it the owner at that price and pocket the difference between what they borrowed it at and what they bought it back at.
2) sometimes, shorts just cover and add additional shares if they believe the stock is going to continue upward. Not sure if there's a special term for this as I don't short stocks, it goes against my investing principals.
I believe the upward trend will continue, this makes it 9 consecutive days of gains for WAMUQ and this is just chump change compared to what the potential settlement could be.
and btw Kuwlness here is a link to the really knowledgable posters there
http://messages.finance.yahoo.com/S...s&bn=86316&tid=224138&mid=224138&tof=63&frt=1
All three have REALLY insightful posts and Bopfan is a lawyer with substancial BK experience (and by the knowledge of her posts I certainly can't question that).
http://messages.finance.yahoo.com/S...s&bn=86316&tid=224138&mid=224138&tof=63&frt=1
All three have REALLY insightful posts and Bopfan is a lawyer with substancial BK experience (and by the knowledge of her posts I certainly can't question that).
Also, everyone needs to keep in mind there is a likelihood that the Preferreds will be converted into commons at some point and that would really make it a level playing field. Word is TPG has already asked to have their Preferreds converted into commons, but this is simply a speculative rumor and I wouldnt put too much into it ... just saying it's a possibility considering the extreme cirumstances. Another 10% day wouldve been nice, but I'll take 60+% any day of the week, lol. Gooo WAMUQ!!
I like the sound of that. People I recommended this to that got in at .10 have been messaging me like crazy asking if they should sell now that they're up 300% ... i tell 'em all the same thing, and that is: "if you've got the free cash, you should be adding, not selling!" I stand by this until we get to $1, then it's too expensive to add in large increments anyway.
Here's a great video chart analysis for WAMUQ by Clay Trader ... one of the best Technical Chart guys I know:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Tkf67NiG2SA
This week:
THJMW is to hear and order the Turnover Action. Thus the 4b$ will be heard and decided at the 10am Friday Omnibus: Other documents aligned: http://www.ghostofwamu.com/documents/09-50551/09-50551-0147.pdf
JPM states that the turnover action can not be heard due to pending appeal: http://www.kccllc.net/documents/0812229/0812229090921000000000011.pdf
A show down at the Delaware Court coming soon ... Court Schedule due mid-week.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Tkf67NiG2SA
This week:
THJMW is to hear and order the Turnover Action. Thus the 4b$ will be heard and decided at the 10am Friday Omnibus: Other documents aligned: http://www.ghostofwamu.com/documents/09-50551/09-50551-0147.pdf
JPM states that the turnover action can not be heard due to pending appeal: http://www.kccllc.net/documents/0812229/0812229090921000000000011.pdf
A show down at the Delaware Court coming soon ... Court Schedule due mid-week.
Wow, LEHLQ had just 75k in volume today. Did you buy the 10k shares today or is that your intent?
I bought 10,000 of LEHMQ today at $0.21 ps. Over 40 million in volume so easy to acquire and hopefully it has a market if i need to sell.
I may add another 9k shares to my WAMUQ holdings now and that will get me to 40,000 shares at an avg cost of $0.20 even. If it drops to $0.25 ps i can still get out with a couple grand and a tremendous learning experience.
:toast:
Sooner, you don't want to get caught flipping these even though it appears you're making extra pocket change. My only words of advice are: how sh!tty would you feel if a settlement was announced tonight and you couldve sold those few thousand shares for $8+/share? Not trying to harp on you, just saying this close to a big trial is prob not the best time to flip 'em especially considering the likelihood that the PPS will continue to run thru Thursday/Friday. Just be careful man, why settle for $400 when you could have several thousand, ya know!? : )
