Fathead--What I am saying is that if you "win" a certain amount, we will call that amout "X". But you can not prove that you lost a certain amount. In which case that only way to be certain that you are paying all that is due the government is to claim 0 losses. (Now if that's filling a false return, what would it be if you accidently, because you really don't know what constitutes a "loss" claimed losses that the government said you did not prove?). I think that would also be filing a false return. What I am clearly saying is that they have mad this topic much too complicated for us-non lawyer folks.
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Intuition BET:
There is not much to really be concerned here.
_Just pay your taxes_ and you will have NOTHING to worry about.
It's a No Brainer<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
WRONG!!!!
Online gambler faces Cass charges
By Dave Forster
After six years as one of Fargo’s top car salesmen, Jeffrey Trauman found a more lucrative -- if not less stressful -- way to make a living.
The father of three became a professional gambler, betting thousands online with offshore sports books, winning enough to support his family and, best of all, working at home with no tie around his neck. To stay right with the law, he disclosed his winnings on tax returns and hired an accounting firm that specialized in gambling, an acquaintance said.
But the lifestyle Trauman thought was legal wasn’t, and in June he was charged in state court with a misdemeanor for gambling, one of the few times local attorneys say they’ve seen the crime prosecuted.
“I don’t think he had any clue he was doing anything that would violate North Dakota law,” said Fargo attorney John Goff, who’s representing Trauman in Cass County District Court.
Though federal law prohibits online sites within the country, it does not prohibit citizens from betting online with offshore casinos. Americans this year will finance about 65 percent of the estimated $6 billion industry, said Keith Furlong, deputy director of the Interactive Gaming Council in Vancouver, British Columbia.
Online bets, whether on a poker hand or a playoff game, become illegal when state law restricts it, as in North Dakota and Minnesota.
Until the state joins Powerball next year, the only legal way to gamble in North Dakota is to play at a tribal casino or with a sanctioned charity, said Keith Lauer, director of the State Gaming Division.
Outside those institutions, any bet more than $25 is an infraction, and any bet more than $500 can be charged as a misdemeanor. Personal bets under $25 also are illegal, Lauer said, but state law does not punishment them.
Online betting also is illegal in Minnesota, said Dave Erickson, an agent with the state’s Public Safety Gambling Enforcement Division.
Which is why Trauman, whose rural Harwood home went up for sale three weeks ago, won’t be moving across the border.
“He is certainly interested in finding a state where this is a legal activity,” Goff said.
Good with numbers
An alumnus of the Wahpeton State College of Science and former Amway distributor, Trauman told investigators he placed his first online bet about five years ago, when he was working for Saturn in Fargo.
After learning the nuances of sports betting, Trauman discovered he could improve his chances of winning by anticipating shifts in point spreads, or “middling.” Basketball was one of the first sports he wagered on, even though he didn’t know much about the game. It didn’t matter, he told an investigator, because he only worked off the spreads.
“Mr. Trauman explained that he is very good with numbers,” State Gaming Auditor Gregory Schlosser wrote in his report.
So good that in fall 2001 he quit his job at Saturn to focus full time on betting. He could make more money at home on his computer, Trauman told Schlosser, even though he was the local Saturn dealer‘s top salesman for six years running. Fargo Saturn officials declined comment.
“Sports betting became Mr. Trauman’s business and he treated it as such,” Schlosser wrote. “He reports on his (tax) returns that his occupation is a professional gambler.”
In April, when agents from the state Bureau of Criminal Investigation served a search warrant at Trauman’s home, they found $43,000 in cash in one desk drawer, according to Schlosser’s report.
Trauman, who declined to comment for this story, cooperated with the agents, explaining how he began bankrolling his accounts and now holds $300,000 overseas.
When an agent asked if he realized his gambling broke the law, Trauman said he never thought so because he only bet for himself, never for anyone else.
Under North Dakota law, if a person facilitates or runs a gambling service, the offense becomes a felony. For Trauman’s misdemeanor, state prosecutors will likely recommend no jail time, a common sentence for first-time offenders.
Assistant Cass County State’s Attorney Mark Boening, the prosecutor who charged Trauman, said gambling cases are rarely seen in court because the state’s law enforcement agencies rarely look into the crime.
“I’ve never seen an investigation like this before,” he said.
Goff, a former Cass County State’s Attorney, said he couldn’t recall charges ever being brought locally against someone for betting online. Most gambling cases come from falsified pull tabs or charity schemes, he said.
Trauman, who doesn’t have to appear in court for his misdemeanor charge, asked his attorney to plead not guilty for him at his arraignment Tuesday.
Goff, who said his client shows no signs of addiction, wouldn’t disclose how much Trauman makes through sports betting.
“He’s done very well,” Goff said. “A significant, if not a majority, of his income comes from this source.”
[This message was edited by Am i tight or not? on August 12, 2003 at 08:16 PM.]
There is not much to really be concerned here.
_Just pay your taxes_ and you will have NOTHING to worry about.
It's a No Brainer<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
WRONG!!!!
Online gambler faces Cass charges
By Dave Forster
After six years as one of Fargo’s top car salesmen, Jeffrey Trauman found a more lucrative -- if not less stressful -- way to make a living.
The father of three became a professional gambler, betting thousands online with offshore sports books, winning enough to support his family and, best of all, working at home with no tie around his neck. To stay right with the law, he disclosed his winnings on tax returns and hired an accounting firm that specialized in gambling, an acquaintance said.
But the lifestyle Trauman thought was legal wasn’t, and in June he was charged in state court with a misdemeanor for gambling, one of the few times local attorneys say they’ve seen the crime prosecuted.
“I don’t think he had any clue he was doing anything that would violate North Dakota law,” said Fargo attorney John Goff, who’s representing Trauman in Cass County District Court.
Though federal law prohibits online sites within the country, it does not prohibit citizens from betting online with offshore casinos. Americans this year will finance about 65 percent of the estimated $6 billion industry, said Keith Furlong, deputy director of the Interactive Gaming Council in Vancouver, British Columbia.
Online bets, whether on a poker hand or a playoff game, become illegal when state law restricts it, as in North Dakota and Minnesota.
Until the state joins Powerball next year, the only legal way to gamble in North Dakota is to play at a tribal casino or with a sanctioned charity, said Keith Lauer, director of the State Gaming Division.
Outside those institutions, any bet more than $25 is an infraction, and any bet more than $500 can be charged as a misdemeanor. Personal bets under $25 also are illegal, Lauer said, but state law does not punishment them.
Online betting also is illegal in Minnesota, said Dave Erickson, an agent with the state’s Public Safety Gambling Enforcement Division.
Which is why Trauman, whose rural Harwood home went up for sale three weeks ago, won’t be moving across the border.
“He is certainly interested in finding a state where this is a legal activity,” Goff said.
Good with numbers
An alumnus of the Wahpeton State College of Science and former Amway distributor, Trauman told investigators he placed his first online bet about five years ago, when he was working for Saturn in Fargo.
After learning the nuances of sports betting, Trauman discovered he could improve his chances of winning by anticipating shifts in point spreads, or “middling.” Basketball was one of the first sports he wagered on, even though he didn’t know much about the game. It didn’t matter, he told an investigator, because he only worked off the spreads.
“Mr. Trauman explained that he is very good with numbers,” State Gaming Auditor Gregory Schlosser wrote in his report.
So good that in fall 2001 he quit his job at Saturn to focus full time on betting. He could make more money at home on his computer, Trauman told Schlosser, even though he was the local Saturn dealer‘s top salesman for six years running. Fargo Saturn officials declined comment.
“Sports betting became Mr. Trauman’s business and he treated it as such,” Schlosser wrote. “He reports on his (tax) returns that his occupation is a professional gambler.”
In April, when agents from the state Bureau of Criminal Investigation served a search warrant at Trauman’s home, they found $43,000 in cash in one desk drawer, according to Schlosser’s report.
Trauman, who declined to comment for this story, cooperated with the agents, explaining how he began bankrolling his accounts and now holds $300,000 overseas.
When an agent asked if he realized his gambling broke the law, Trauman said he never thought so because he only bet for himself, never for anyone else.
Under North Dakota law, if a person facilitates or runs a gambling service, the offense becomes a felony. For Trauman’s misdemeanor, state prosecutors will likely recommend no jail time, a common sentence for first-time offenders.
Assistant Cass County State’s Attorney Mark Boening, the prosecutor who charged Trauman, said gambling cases are rarely seen in court because the state’s law enforcement agencies rarely look into the crime.
“I’ve never seen an investigation like this before,” he said.
Goff, a former Cass County State’s Attorney, said he couldn’t recall charges ever being brought locally against someone for betting online. Most gambling cases come from falsified pull tabs or charity schemes, he said.
Trauman, who doesn’t have to appear in court for his misdemeanor charge, asked his attorney to plead not guilty for him at his arraignment Tuesday.
Goff, who said his client shows no signs of addiction, wouldn’t disclose how much Trauman makes through sports betting.
“He’s done very well,” Goff said. “A significant, if not a majority, of his income comes from this source.”
[This message was edited by Am i tight or not? on August 12, 2003 at 08:16 PM.]
Also--On the Federal tax forms, for gambling winnings you are to list where the winnings came from. So, did he list each and every sportsbook (wins at each and losses at each)? Or did he simple list Neteller as the payor. (My spelling and tying is not the best.) I would really like to know what he put down or his tax preparer put down).
am i tight or not...nice post
I see one big mistake this person made, do not write down professional sportsbettor....thats a big RED FLAG
There was another simular discussion awhile back where a tax accountant advised to put down Offshore Funds Investor , the IRS doesn't care what you do or how you make your money they just want there legal cut.
I see one big mistake this person made, do not write down professional sportsbettor....thats a big RED FLAG
There was another simular discussion awhile back where a tax accountant advised to put down Offshore Funds Investor , the IRS doesn't care what you do or how you make your money they just want there legal cut.
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by oldmantime:
Also--On the Federal tax forms, for gambling winnings you are to list where the winnings came from. So, did he list each and every sportsbook (wins at each and losses at each)? Or did he simple list Neteller as the payor. (My spelling and tying is not the best.) I would really like to know what he put down or his tax preparer put down).<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
Oldman, the IRS requires that you keep a detailed betting log, in case of audit, to back up your claims. On the tax forms, your offshore wins would be under "other income" pointing to the attached worksheet which indicates "gambling winnings not reported on form W2-G". If the IRS questions it, you can prove both with your log.
Also--On the Federal tax forms, for gambling winnings you are to list where the winnings came from. So, did he list each and every sportsbook (wins at each and losses at each)? Or did he simple list Neteller as the payor. (My spelling and tying is not the best.) I would really like to know what he put down or his tax preparer put down).<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
Oldman, the IRS requires that you keep a detailed betting log, in case of audit, to back up your claims. On the tax forms, your offshore wins would be under "other income" pointing to the attached worksheet which indicates "gambling winnings not reported on form W2-G". If the IRS questions it, you can prove both with your log.
This is why (For me anyway), if Congress makes it a criminal offense to bet offshore--I will stop. It would no longer be an enjoyable activity. Add to that--if--I should win; the way I would report it now would be from bank statements showing Neteller deposits, for I have no earthly idea, from which sportsbook I won the plays . But I do have a record of ALL neteller deposits and cashouts. If they need more than that--might as well turn myself in--because I simply would NOT KNOW!
Am i tight or not? -
1) Yes - pay your taxes on your winnings.(if any)
2) Don't gamble in a Dum fu(k state like N. Dakota without consulting the law and a lawyer before you declare your winnings.( Ring the DUH Bell)
3) The dum fuk in N.Dakota was only charged with a misdemeanor.
4) If offshore/online gamblers show a pattern of NOT declaring their winnings, you gamblers that do not report your winnings will play the BIGGEST hand in shutting down this industry as we know it.
1) Yes - pay your taxes on your winnings.(if any)
2) Don't gamble in a Dum fu(k state like N. Dakota without consulting the law and a lawyer before you declare your winnings.( Ring the DUH Bell)
3) The dum fuk in N.Dakota was only charged with a misdemeanor.
4) If offshore/online gamblers show a pattern of NOT declaring their winnings, you gamblers that do not report your winnings will play the BIGGEST hand in shutting down this industry as we know it.
Trauman has said he could not make a living just on middling, it was just one example he explained to those who were questioning him about his wagers. He said he had researched several states after his problems. He thinks he will be okay in Kentucky. The attorney general's office there could not find any law prohibiting wagering, although they would not put it in writing that he was legal.
Thats exactly the way I see it but there seems to be some debate over what is taxable and what is not.
There is a thread here started by a tax acct. and they claim you better report all winnings first then you can itemize losses. It looks more like a scare tactic to drum up bussiness as they have a link to there firm.
There is a thread here started by a tax acct. and they claim you better report all winnings first then you can itemize losses. It looks more like a scare tactic to drum up bussiness as they have a link to there firm.
