Scottie Pippen to Kwame Brown "Hold my beer."

[festeringZit]

Yeah. In Pippen's defense---Jordan did retire abruptly and team never had the time to fill the Jordan void with another player and start building around Scottie. They also did make the ECF even after the bombshell of Jordan walking away...

He was good with Portland. Blew that 15 point 4th quarter lead against shaq/Kobe in WCF.

Pippen was a hell of a player and pretty much, even before all this stuff, got mocked.

He was a hell of a player, but he did some stupid things:

- Refused to go back into a playoff game when the last shot was drawn up for Tony Kukoc
- Didn't play in game 7 of eastern conf finals against Detroit because of a headache
- Notorious for making bad investment decisions: https://thesportsrush.com/nba-news-...on-aircraft-made-a-massive-1-million-mistake/

 

[Avocado33]

Yeah. In Pippen's defense---Jordan did retire abruptly and team never had the time to fill the Jordan void with another player and start building around Scottie. They also did make the ECF even after the bombshell of Jordan walking away...

Yep

LeBron walks away from any of those 2015-18 Cavs teams and they are not a playoff team. Maybe a fringe one in 2017

2018 they would have been 19-63

 

[crudebar]

He was a hell of a player, but he did some stupid things:

- Refused to go back into a playoff game when the last shot was drawn up for Tony Kukoc
- Didn't play in game 7 of eastern conf finals against Detroit because of a headache
- Notorious for making bad investment decisions: https://thesportsrush.com/nba-news-...on-aircraft-made-a-massive-1-million-mistake/

Yep. All true.

Why I also give much credit to Phil Jackson as the greatest head coach of all-time. Kept Pippen along with Rodman in line to keep producing and keep winning championships.

To think all this and it was Jerry Krause that ended the parades.

It's funny this was sooooo long ago and Bulls have never been back to a Finals since...

 

[crudebar]

Yep

LeBron walks away from any of those 2015-18 Cavs teams and they are not a playoff team. Maybe a fringe one in 2017

2018 they would have been 19-63

True.

But also remember the east was sooo watered down there was actual talk of realigning the east and west teams. Then talk of just taking the 16 best teams no matter conference.

Add a top 5 player(which James was by year 2) and any of those east teams would be 50 wins.(imo)

 

[crudebar]

But to be completely fair Giannis nor Tatum could get to Finals in what turned out to be a pretty laughable east this season.

The number of Finals James made with consistency shouldn't be ignored. I just think he needs more championships to rival Jordan who won all 6 in dominate fashion. I take the way the championships were won into account also. Not just 6 to 4. I think that is also important on how you won them. But that's just me.

 

[Avocado33]

True.

But also remember the east was sooo watered down there was actual talk of realigning the east and west teams. Then talk of just taking the 16 best teams no matter conference.

Add a top 5 player(which James was by year 2) and any of those east teams would be 50 wins.(imo)

What you talking about? You're trying to tell me these Isiah Thomas Celtics weren't great?

 

[Avocado33]

But to be completely fair Giannis nor Tatum could get to Finals in what turned out to be a pretty laughable east this season.

The number of Finals James made with consistency shouldn't be ignored. I just think he needs more championships to rival Jordan who won all 6 in dominate fashion. I take the way the championships were won into account also. Not just 6 to 4. I think that is also important on how you won them. But that's just me.

It was a weaker conference at the time, but 25-0 last 25 series against the East is hard to accomplish.

36-5 from 2015 to 2017 against the East in the playoffs. Pretty insane. Think they played one Game 6 (the year they won the title I believe, against the Raptors in the ECF)

The flood gates were open for either the Bucks or the Celtics this year. Can't help but feel it was a missed opportunity, especially for Boston

 

[crudebar]

What you talking about? You're trying to tell me these Isiah Thomas Celtics weren't great?

lol. haha. i more like to pick on the lowry/derozen teams.

I do remember this one series(and i could be remembering the specifics wrong) When Brad Stevens was coaching the Cs and they had lost Kyrie for the season and they were being lead by a very young tatum and brown and Cs got up 2-0 in the series and all the sports media was going crazy over "who you prefer stevens or lebron on your team if you had to chose one." Lebron went out and beat them the last 4.

Like i said could be remembering the exact specifics wrong but remember the narrative. I remember thinking--is this real i'll take the superstar player over a coach any day. No one is paying a coach 40 million a year and there is a reason for that...

 

[Avocado33]

I take the way the championships were won into account also. Not just 6 to 4. I think that is also important on how you won them. But that's just me.

I think Jordan's strongest argument is the dominance in those series.

But LeBron also had to come back from 3-1 against a 73-win team, and win two on the road. For perspective, that Warriors team had at one point won 54 consecutive home games. So just to win back to back there, let alone to complete a 3-1 comeback in the NBA Finals, is astonishing

The ESPN talking heads were discussing if Boston coming back from 3-0 would have been greatest comeback ever, and it was emphatic no's across the board. They were right on that one.

 

[Avocado33]

lol. haha. i more like to pick on the lowry/derozen teams.

I do remember that one series(and i could be remembering the specifics wrong) When Brad Stevens was coaching the Cs and they had lost Kyrie for the season and they were being lead by a very young tatum and brown and Cs got up 2-0 in the series and all the sports media was going crazy over "who you prefer stevens or lebron on your team if you had to chose one." Lebron went out and beat them the last 4.

Like i said could be remembering the exact specifics wrong but remember the narrative. I remember thinking--is this real i'll take the superstar player over a coach any day.

Oh that was 2018. Celtics went up 2-0 at home, started running their mouths, and Cavs ended up winning in 7 with that shit team. I actually went to Game 4 of that series in Cleveland.

Boston had dominated their home court. But Celtics, in typical fashion, score 79 in the home Game 7 with a trip to the Finals on the line .

 

[Avocado33]

lol. haha. i more like to pick on the lowry/derozen teams.

The 2018 Cavs were so trash, beat the Pacers in Round 1 in 7 games then the Celtics series I just mentioned in 7 in ECF.

But the second round, they swept the top-seeded Raptors as a 4 seed. Getting like 7 points in the first two games. LeBron was just clowning them in Game 2, hitting ridiculous fade away shots. Literally ended the "DeRozan era" (lol)

Then Game 3 he hit that insane one-legged buzzer beater to just crush them more

LeBronto

 

[crudebar]

I think Jordan's strongest argument is the dominance in those series.

But LeBron also had to come back from 3-1 against a 73-win team, and win two on the road. For perspective, that Warriors team had at one point won 54 consecutive home games. So just to win back to back there, let alone to complete a 3-1 comeback in the NBA Finals

The ESPN talking heads were discussing if Boston coming back from 3-0 would have been greatest comeback ever, and it was emphatic no's across the board. They were right on that one.

I agree. Boston coming back from 0-3 to as Gilbert Arenas put it "a YMCA team" would NOT have been the greatest comeback. The fact they were down 0-3 was just laughable on the surface.

Lebron faced tougher opponents in the Finals. We agree there. But he also made more Finals because of those super teams. The level of talent is around same every season its just if its top heavy. If James had to face 2 or 3 teams that were equal or a little bit better or worse talent wise or got to face all cupcakes until meeting the end boss one could argue the path difficulty is around equal.

I will concede the KD Warriors were stupid good.

 

[Avocado33]

I agree. Boston coming back from 0-3 to as Gilbert Arenas put it "a YMCA team" would NOT have been the greatest comeback. The fact they were down 0-3 was just laughable on the surface.

Lebron faced tougher opponents in the Finals. We agree there. But he also made more Finals because of those super teams. The level of talent is the same every season its just if its top heavy. If James had to face 2 or 3 teams that were equally or a little bit better or worse talent wise or got to face all cupcakes until meeting the end boss one could argue the path difficulty is around equal.

He probably gets stopped short of the Finals once or twice in those 8 straight years he made the Finals (after his initial stint in Cleveland)

 

[crudebar]

He probably gets stopped short of the Finals once or twice in those 8 straight years he made the Finals (after his initial stint in Cleveland)

He did lose to teams in the Finals they should have/could have beaten. The Spurs(Heat) and Mavs come to mind.

Not like he was facing KD warriors every single season. I understand KD got hurt but the Raptors also won a championship during the KD warrior years.

 

[Avocado33]

He did lose to teams in the Finals they should have/could have beaten. The Spurs(Heat) and Mavs come to mind.

Not like he was facing KD warriors every single season. I understand KD got hurt but the Raptors also won a championship during the KD warrior years.

Mavs one is the one that is inexcusable, biggest blemish on LeBron's resume. Heat should have won that series, Game 4 was a disaster

Spurs in 2014 probably "could" have, but the Heat were just breaking down. Wade and Bosh were on fumes. That Spurs team was also just pretty damn good. It was the KD Warriors

The hypothetical that goes in LeBron's favor is what happens in 2015 if Kyrie + Love aren't hurt. Going to Game 6 with Dellavadova, Mosgov, Shumpert in the lineup lol

 

[Avocado33]

Not like he was facing KD warriors every single season. I understand KD got hurt but the Raptors also won a championship during the KD warrior years.

Yeah but gotta remember KD didn't play

Warriors did sweep Blazers without him. KD basically eviscerated Kawhi every time they played against each other back then. It's one of those weird one-sided star rivalries where KD would absolutely light Kawhi on fire every time they played. So that probably changes things

 

[crudebar]

Mavs one is the one that is inexcusable, biggest blemish on LeBron's resume. Heat should have won that series, Game 4 was a disaster

Spurs in 2014 probably "could" have, but the Heat were just breaking down. Wade and Bosh were on fumes. That Spurs team was also just pretty damn good. It was the KD Warriors

The hypothetical that goes in LeBron's favor is what happens in 2015 if Kyrie + Love aren't hurt. Going to Game 6 with Dellavadova, Mosgov, Shumpert in the lineup lol

In 2015 they got up 2-1 and still lost in 6.

I do remember betting Warriors when it did get 1-2 and screaming some white dude that is probably as athletic as myself is their number 2. There is no way they win this series.

Surprisely at that point many believed Lebron could pull it off. I agree that was a funny time. People actually started believing Delly was actually good even a few years later. Laughable.

 

[crudebar]

Even though I show luck played a factor in a few of LeBron's championships. I can't give him credit for 2015 unlucky because they didn't even make it to the final game.

 

[Avocado33]

In 2015 they got up 2-1 and still lost in 6.

I do remember betting Warriors when it did get 1-2 and screaming some white dude that is probably as athletic as myself is their number 2. There is no way they win this series.

Surprisely at that point many believed Lebron could pull it off. I agree that was a funny time. People actually started believing Delly was actually good even a few years later. Laughable.

Curry was pretty bad that series until he finally clowned Delly in Game 5

Iggy won the Finals MVP, which was kind of a joke

That might've been the year to give the MVP to a guy on a losing team, because LeBron was far and away the best player in that series

 

[Greenbacks]

Yeah. In Pippen's defense---Jordan did retire abruptly and team never had the time to fill the Jordan void with another player and start building around Scottie. They also did make the ECF even after the bombshell of Jordan walking away...

He was good with Portland. Blew that 15 point 4th quarter lead against shaq/Kobe in WCF.

Pippen was a hell of a player and pretty much, even before all this stuff, got mocked.

Michael Jordan made Pippen.
Pippen is 1 of the greatest robins of all time that's it.
He was lost without Michael