Quarterbacks in the draft

[MattyMatt]

I’m not a huge believer in Jimmy G. But...

Him or Cam? I think that’s a no brainer. Jimmy G is no Tom Brady. But he’s a serviceable QB that can win in this league if he stays healthy. We all saw Cam last year. God awful.

If you like 5 yard out routes being thrown at the feet of your receivers on a consistent basis? Cam is your guy.

How about neither. Cam was a garbage move to begin with too. Bringing in more garbage might win you a couple more games, but it’s not gonna get you the job done...

San Fran might end up having the most talent in the League, and they know they can’t win a SB with Wet Noodle, and neither can anyone else. Won’t even come close, again...

 

[MattyMatt]

No doubt, Cam sucks. No doubt, Jimmy G is "serviceable". But we know that he was just the first secure piece in a bigger Belichick plan. The question is, what is that bigger plan? And I hope it's bigger than Jimmy G.

Surely it is...

 

[Dr.Love]

How about neither. Cam was a garbage move to begin with too. Bringing in more garbage might win you a couple more games, but it’s not gonna get you the job done...

San Fran might end up having the most talent in the League, and they know they can’t win a SB with Wet Noodle, and neither can anyone else. Won’t even come close, again...

Oh I agree with neither for sure. But if Garoppolo is the plan C due to things not falling your way with plan A and B? I'd take him all day over Cam. And it's not really even close.

 

[CHOPTALK]

Jimmy G is a stud

 

[Avocado33]

I’m not a huge believer in Jimmy G. But...

Him or Cam? I think that’s a no brainer. Jimmy G is no Tom Brady. But he’s a serviceable QB that can win in this league if he stays healthy. We all saw Cam last year. God awful.

If you like 5 yard out routes being thrown at the feet of your receivers on a consistent basis? Cam is your guy.

An important ability to have is AVAILability, and Jimmy G is an injury prone QB. So that’s a huge if.

Jimmy G has proven to be good enough to not completely fuck it up for a team, if he has a very good supporting cast. If Jimmy G was working with the garbage New England has offensively, he’d look awful

 

[MattyMatt]

Jimmy G is a stud

I’d love to see him go to New Orleans then...

 

[Michelangelo]

I’d love to see him go to New Orleans then...

Me too. Give Chop his wish. Please.

 

[Serbone]

Pocket passer?? This is 2021 every team seeks a mobile QB, who can run and scramble from the get go. Perhaps later in their careers they can adapt to being a pocket passer if they've been successful enough.

like RG3?
Vincent Jones?
Michael Vick?
they never adapted to pocket passer
will Wentz adapt?
will Trubisky adapt?
Watson has
will Mahomes need to adapt he’s getting dinged

how have pocket QBs Brady, Brees, Rivers, done, did they play effectively for >18 years?

IMO it’s clear QBs can’t run in the NFL against the HGH mutants on defense these days

 

[carlitosway]

like RG3?
Vincent Jones?
Michael Vick?
they never adapted to pocket passer
will Wentz adapt?
will Trubisky adapt?
Watson has
will Mahomes need to adapt he’s getting dinged

how have pocket QBs Brady, Brees, Rivers, done, did they play effectively for >18 years?

IMO it’s clear QBs can’t run in the NFL against the HGH mutants on defense these days

Cunningham YES one of the originals
Vick I'd say yes but DOG gate hurt him. Still a pretty good career.
Vincent Jones WTF is that? Do you mean Vince Young?

Now let's go to the present era...

Mahomes is great he'll adapt
Allen very good he'll adapt
Wilson great, adapted.
Goff pocket QB stock is DOWN
Kyler Murray very good young mobile QB
Jimmy G pocket, injury prone, stock is down.

Winston mobile/remains to be seen about pocket QBing and future
Hill mobile
Bridgwater mobile
Jones mobile
Prescott mobile
Hurts mobile
Rodgers not as mobile as he use to be but adapted to the pocket and can still move around at 37.
More mobile QB's
Cam, Darnold, Tua, Jackson, Burrow, Carr, Herbert and theme goes on and on and on...

Young talented QBs who will be drafted high in the draft all mobile, Lawrence, Wilson, Fields, Lance. The trend continues on and on and on. All QBs from early in their careers in this era, can run and be mobile and throw on the run and if they can have success and still be in the league by the time they're 30 they can adjust to the pocket if need be. QB's can't be statues from the start of their careers they need legs to motor.

 

[Dr.Love]

Cunningham YES one of the originals

Loved his game. Those Eagle teams deserved more. Great defense. Just couldn't get over the hump. Buddy just didn't pay enough attention to the offense...

Back in the day.. When a QB would double as a punter. Amazing. He was a great punter too. One of the best punts ever. I think it was in Buffalo.

Danny White used to double as a punter too in Dallas. Danny White. Probably the most under appreciated QB of all time. He was good. Just couldn't get Dallas over the hump in the early 80's. Couple NFC championship games. He wasn't Roger. So Dallas never loved him.

 

[Serbone]

"Mobile" is fine.
But running all the time does not work, NFL defenses will make a cripple out of a QB that runs too much.
Run for a first down on third down twice a game when necessary, see a wide open gap to run on 3rd & 7? Fine.
Run as part of the offense like RG3 and others, nope.
Mahomes runs too much and is paying a price, I think he can adapt. Watson did after getting hammered a few years.
IMO Fields value too much is in his running, not so sure he will be an NFL pocket passer if he passes instead of option run/ pass.
Wentz ran way too much and is hobbled, maybe he can adapt in better surroundings.
Trubisky, too, ran too much, shoulder and other injuries made him look bad, he may get another chance and wise up.
Hurts has not been a good passer thus far in the NFL, and eventually if he keeps running will get pulverized, I do not see him has being even a middle of the pack NFL QB, will be 24th-26th out of 32 or so.
Mac Jones can run for a first down or two when necessary, and is an NFL style passer. I would take him after Lawrence and Wilson but before Fields and way way before the little league QB Lance, no way, he is a huge risk.

 

[carlitosway]

Loved his game. Those Eagle teams deserved more. Great defense. Just couldn't get over the hump. Buddy just didn't pay enough attention to the offense...

Back in the day.. When a QB would double as a punter. Amazing. He was a great punter too. One of the best punts ever. I think it was in Buffalo.

Danny White used to double as a punter too in Dallas. Danny White. Probably the most under appreciated QB of all time. He was good. Just couldn't get Dallas over the hump in the early 80's. Couple NFC championship games. He wasn't Roger. So Dallas never loved him.

Cunningham was the ultimate weapon. The punt was here at Giants Stadium. White was terrific another under appreciated QB he played in Staubach's shadow and Montana and the 49ers dynasty. Here's a flashback Love to that 91 yard punt...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FzMLLmcD1mE

 

[carlitosway]

"Mobile" is fine.
But running all the time does not work, NFL defenses will make a cripple out of a QB that runs too much.
Run for a first down on third down twice a game when necessary, see a wide open gap to run on 3rd & 7? Fine.
Run as part of the offense like RG3 and others, nope.
Mahomes runs too much and is paying a price, I think he can adapt. Watson did after getting hammered a few years.
IMO Fields value too much is in his running, not so sure he will be an NFL pocket passer if he passes instead of option run/ pass.
Wentz ran way too much and is hobbled, maybe he can adapt in better surroundings.
Trubisky, too, ran too much, shoulder and other injuries made him look bad, he may get another chance and wise up.
Hurts has not been a good passer thus far in the NFL, and eventually if he keeps running will get pulverized, I do not see him has being even a middle of the pack NFL QB, will be 24th-26th out of 32 or so.
Mac Jones can run for a first down or two when necessary, and is an NFL style passer. I would take him after Lawrence and Wilson but before Fields and way way before the little league QB Lance, no way, he is a huge risk.

Mac Jones might be good but not special or have a higher ceiling than the other guys. Who was the last good QB out of 'Bama? Joe Namath,lol. Pocket QBing is a thing of the past get with the times you're behind. You can't even offer up enough examples to justify your argument. I just laundry listed you and you fired back with Brady, the greatest ever. Rivers and Brees just retired and a weak argument about Mahomes running too much and paying the price?!? You "think" he can adapt?!? Good lord. You don't follow the NFL do you? Why is he in danger of getting pummeled because he got harassed in the SB because he was missing TWO starting OLmen, please. RGlll past history, was a straight up bust for his lack of QB ability not because he ran all the time. Fields we know nothing about how his game will translate. Wentz doesn't run all the time will see how he does in Indy reunited with Reich. Hurts incomplete grade still being evaluated by all but I like his ability to be mobile! He does not run exclusively. NFL franchises don't want a statue from the start as a QB unless they can cover for that QB with a great OL.

 

[Michelangelo]

Mac Jones might be good but not special or have a higher ceiling than the other guys. Who was the last good QB out of 'Bama? Joe Namath,lol. Pocket QBing is a thing of the past get with the times you're behind. You can't even offer up enough examples to justify your argument. I just laundry listed you and you fired back with Brady, the greatest ever. Rivers and Brees just retired and a weak argument about Mahomes running too much and paying the price?!? You "think" he can adapt?!? Good lord. You don't follow the NFL do you? Why is he in danger of getting pummeled because he got harassed in the SB because he was missing TWO starting OLmen, please. RGlll past history, was a straight up bust for his lack of QB ability not because he ran all the time. Fields we know nothing about how his game will translate. Wentz doesn't run all the time will see how he does in Indy reunited with Reich. Hurts incomplete grade still being evaluated by all but I like his ability to be mobile! He does not run exclusively. NFL franchises don't want a statue from the start as a QB unless they can cover for that QB with a great OL.

I agree that the NFL appears to be transitioning at the QB position.

But you can't deny that the SB was just won by a pocket passer who was in his first year with his new team.

The Championship games had pocket passers in three of the four QB positions.

Brady 1 rush -1 yd
Rogers 0 rushes - 0 yds
Maholmes 5 rushes - 5 yds
Allen 7 rushes - 88 yds

So it would be foolish of us to say that the pocket passer is obsolete. Actually the narrative should be that the running QB has yet to prove successful at the ultimate level.

 

[carlitosway]

I agree that the NFL appears to be transitioning at the QB position.

But you can't deny that the SB was just won by a pocket passer who was in his first year with his new team.

The Championship games had pocket passers in three of the four QB positions.

Brady 1 rush -1 yd
Rogers 0 rushes - 0 yds
Maholmes 5 rushes - 5 yds
Allen 7 rushes - 88 yds

So it would be foolish of us to say that the pocket passer is obsolete. Actually the narrative should be that the running QB has yet to prove successful at the ultimate level.

Sorry three of the four except for Brady are not PURE POCKET QBs. They have the ability, to run, scramble, roll out. The transition has been in effect for years. And Brady is just phenomenal and greatest ever with a good OL to help mask his weakness for being immobile. The statues of the NFL that are not mobile who can only QB from the pocket are Big Ben, Goff, Ryan, Dalton and Brady (EXCUSED as cited repeatedly). I think it's foolish to say the solely playing from the pocket is alright. QBs have to be multi-faceted.

 

[Willie99]

The biggest problem for mobile QB's is that they become immobile QB's and their career paths either change of fade away

I'm also going to suggest the top QB's in this year's draft are NOT highly rated because of mobility. They're tall, they're smart, they're good passers with strong arms

 

[carlitosway]

The biggest problem for mobile QB's is that they become immobile QB's and their career paths either change of fade away

I'm also going to suggest the top QB's in this year's draft are NOT highly rated because of mobility. They're tall, they're smart, they're good passers with strong arms

They're all of the above WITH the mobility. Not Mack Jones he lacks mobility.

 

[Michelangelo]

Sorry three of the four except for Brady are not PURE POCKET QBs. They have the ability, to run, scramble, roll out. The transition has been in effect for years. And Brady is just phenomenal and greatest ever with a good OL to help mask his weakness for being immobile. The statues of the NFL that are not mobile who can only QB from the pocket are Big Ben, Goff, Ryan, Dalton and Brady (EXCUSED as cited repeatedly). I think it's foolish to say the solely playing from the pocket is alright. QBs have to be multi-faceted.

I never said "pure pocket passers". I said pocket passers. Look at the Championship Game numbers I presented. Calling them runners is a total mischaracterization.

Here are your SB QBs for the past five years:

Brady
Maholmes

Maholmes
Jimmy G

Brady
Goff

Brady
Ryan

Peyton Manning
Cam Newton

Don't tell me that a pocket passer can't still be successful in the NFL. You're dreaming of a more exciting game. But it's not here yet at the top level.

 

[chrishansen]

You don’t beat the speed of a defense with mobile Quarterbacks

You beat the speed of defenses with the speed of anticipation and accuracy. That’s the only thing elite athletic speed will never be able to beat.

Arm strength is not even that important. Quarterbacks who can anticipate with accuracy will always move the chains more efficiently.

The quarterback are more protected than ever in the pocket also. And pass interference is now a weapon for throwing.

The mobile QB has no advantages outside the pocket. And can even create more holding calls on scrambles. It’s harder for lines to block with moving QBs

I wouldn’t consider a mobile QB unless anticipation and accuracy are strengths.

 

[Dr.Love]

The mobile QB has no advantages outside the pocket.

Decent post. You made some very good points. Outside of this quoted portion. And then you ruined it.

The mobile QB has no advantages outside the pocket? That's a straight up retarded take.