I hear you Jaypaw but the problems they had on Sunday on defense were already well known (the run D). As for the offense they just didn't execute very well. Donovan was off all day and never really had any flow to his game. The running game was nonexistent (only 9 running plays) and with a somewhat unhealthy Westbrook they really gave up on running the football way too soon.
RUN THE BALL ANDY! This team will be ok. They ran into the buzzsaw that is the red hot Pittsburgh Steelers right now. They're still a very good football team (the best in the NFC...and I include the Packers in that comparison).
sb
RUN THE BALL ANDY! This team will be ok. They ran into the buzzsaw that is the red hot Pittsburgh Steelers right now. They're still a very good football team (the best in the NFC...and I include the Packers in that comparison).
sb
kayaman said:
On paper pitt does not look like that solid of a play to me.
You did state some good facts - "Pitts offense is scoring more" and "Pitts D is allowing less points"
But its only a start - there are a lot more stats out there to go over.
The first thing I look at is with Staley out what will the potential impact be?
Last week vs Philly Bettis ran for a good clip so he will easily do the same vs cleveland right? Wrong on paper:
Philly is the 6th worst in the league in terms of rush yards allowed per game.
Cleveland is 9th best.
In passing offense yds per game Cleveland is 8th worst in the league - terrible right? Well Pittsburgh is 9th worst.
In Pass Defense Pitt is 6th best in the league which is certainly formidable - and Cleveland's 24th ranked pass O doesn't seem like it would match up well, however Garcia managed to gain above pitts average allowed IN pitt gaining 210 yards in the air.
The difference in the game AT pitt was undoubtedly the success Staley had on the ground (117 yds and a TD).
Now without staley the question is whether or not the cleveland D can stop bettis. Its actually possible - that cleveland (again a top 10 run D overall) could stop him.
Then it remains to be seen whether or not if it comes down to a test of their pass D whether or not they will pass that test. But its food for thought - and in my opinion it shows that "on paper" pitt isnt necessarily the obvious choice.
GL
Forgot to mention strength of schedule
There are a couple of ways to quantify this.
The most simple way is to look at the combined records of the opponents of both teams:
The combined record of Clevelands opponents is 38-26.
Pitts opponents have a record of 32-34.
This isnt a perfect method of assessing who has a tougher schedule of course because it doesnt take into account who their opponents faced to get those records, nor does it adjust in any way for severly aweful teams that could skew the overall results.
But on the face of it its probably safe to assume that they at least have a comparable schedule in terms of their opponents (if not a slight advantage cleveland)
GL
There are a couple of ways to quantify this.
The most simple way is to look at the combined records of the opponents of both teams:
The combined record of Clevelands opponents is 38-26.
Pitts opponents have a record of 32-34.
This isnt a perfect method of assessing who has a tougher schedule of course because it doesnt take into account who their opponents faced to get those records, nor does it adjust in any way for severly aweful teams that could skew the overall results.
But on the face of it its probably safe to assume that they at least have a comparable schedule in terms of their opponents (if not a slight advantage cleveland)
GL
Take the Home Dog
Cleveland is better than everyone thinks....they played baltimore tough sunday night, they could have pulled the upset, 10 yard punt in the 4th cost them the game, then they drove to the 5 against one of the best defenses in the NFL. Pittsburgh has to have a letdown sooner or later, i'll take sooner and go with the Browns to pull the upset
Cleveland is better than everyone thinks....they played baltimore tough sunday night, they could have pulled the upset, 10 yard punt in the 4th cost them the game, then they drove to the 5 against one of the best defenses in the NFL. Pittsburgh has to have a letdown sooner or later, i'll take sooner and go with the Browns to pull the upset
<TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=0 width="90%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD width="100%"><SMALL>Berea, OH (Sports Network) - Cleveland lost offensive lineman Kelvin Garmon and defensive back Leigh Bodden, who both suffered season-ending injuries in a loss at Baltimore on Sunday.</SMALL></TD></TR><TR><TD width="100%"> </TD></TR><TR><TD width="100%"><SMALL>Garmon, a guard, injured his medial collateral, anterior cruciate and posterior ligaments in his right knee.
Bodden. a special teams standout, tore a chest muscle in the second half.
Browns head coach Butch Davis said Bodden stayed in the game three or four plays before coming out.
Wide receiver Andre' Davis (toe) and punter Derrick Frost (ankle) both got hurt against the Ravens, and are list as day-to-day.</SMALL></TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE>
Bodden. a special teams standout, tore a chest muscle in the second half.
Browns head coach Butch Davis said Bodden stayed in the game three or four plays before coming out.
Wide receiver Andre' Davis (toe) and punter Derrick Frost (ankle) both got hurt against the Ravens, and are list as day-to-day.</SMALL></TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE>
A banged-up backfield
By BOB LABRIOLA
PITTSBURGH – The running game has been an integral part of the foundation that was laid painstakingly by Coach Bill Cowher and his staff of assistants from the day the players reported for training camp at the end of July.
It has helped Ben Roethlisberger thrive as a rookie quarterback; it has helped the team control the clock; it has kept the defense off the field; it was the difference in the back-to-back decisive wins over New England and Philadelphia.
But as the Steelers prepare for a fortnight that holds consecutive road games against division opponents starting this Sunday in Cleveland, they are hurting where they have been so strong all season.
"We have a few bumps here going into this game," said Cowher.
Do they ever.
Duce Staley did not play against the Eagles because of a tender hamstring, and Cowher listed him as questionable for Sunday’s game in Cleveland because of that injury. Now, Staley will be joined on the injury report by Verron Haynes and Dan Kreider, and the Steelers may need to plug some holes in a part of their offense that had been punching big holes in opposing defenses.
Haynes starts the week listed as doubtful with a case of turf toe; Kreider is questionable with a hip flexor that prevented him from finishing the game against the Eagles last Sunday. All of a sudden, Willie Parker and Matt Cushing find themselves as the guys who may be next to be asked to step up and replace a front-line player without allowing for a drop-off in performance by the unit as a whole.
"It seems that every week, there is somebody new stepping up," said Cowher. "There have been some constants and you have to have good solid play from a lot of players. But when other people have had to step in, they have stepped in and we never missed a beat. It goes back all the way back to the training camp element of it, and there is going to be more down the road. Like I said before, everybody has a role and some guys would like to be a little more involved, but they have put the team before themselves. They recognize that when a guy gets hurt, you have to be ready to seize that opportunity.
"We have had a number of players who have been able to do that."
It started with Keydrick Vincent for Kendall Simmons, who sustained a season-ending knee injury back on Aug. 15. The most recent example was Jerome Bettis, who carried 33 times and rushed for 149 yards against the Eagles after Staley was made inactive because of his hamstring.
When everyone in the backfield is healthy, Staley is the starter, and Bettis is the short-yardage/goal-line specialist; Kreider is the fullback, and Haynes is the third-down back.
Cowher said that if Kreider cannot play, Cushing would get first crack at the starting fullback job, but the team also signed J.T. Wall to the practice squad as insurance. Wall was a No. 7 draft choice in 2003, who spent that season on the practice squad and was waived on the final cut this year after a respectable showing at training camp this summer. Cowher also said Parker is the top candidate to be the third-down back if Haynes cannot play.
Depending upon how much the injured players can heal during the week, Cowher could find himself with some interesting game day decisions in Cleveland. Resting Staley for the sake of saving him doesn’t seem to be an option he is considering.
"This is a very important game," said Cowher. "I think they are all important games. At the same time, you have to look at the big picture, and we will continue to take both of those into account and see where Duce is and go from there. We are not in any position to be resting anybody. There is such a fine line in this business, and we are playing with a little bit of an edge right now and we can’t lose that. You can lose it quickly in this business.
"It starts with our preparation and Sundays have been a reflection of how we prepare. We have to put together a good week of work and having to deal with the added obstacle of the noise, the atmosphere we are going into, we need everybody who can go in this football game."
The heartening aspect of this is that there is nothing wrong with the Steelers offensive line, and it has been the play of that unit that’s really been the difference of late. It’s ridiculous to assert that anyone could gain big yards running behind the Steelers offensive line, but it’s also foolish to underestimate the impact those guys are having right now.
If it’s necessary, Cowher believes Bettis can carry the ball 33 more times in Cleveland.
"We are not going to change," said Cowher. "We have to have some healthy backs. I think I named about every back that we have on injury list except Willie Parker, so he better get himself ready to play. But if we have to, Jerome played very well and our line did a good job.
"But don’t take anything away from the way that he ran against the Eagles, because Jerome Bettis ran very well. He made a lot of guys miss. He got a lot of yardage after the initial contact, but the line did a super job again and it is going to take another big effort because this Browns team has been a grind to run the football against. "I know the last time we played them, we had a lot of the same circumstances that we have had the last couple of weeks -- opportunities to run out the clock with the lead, and we couldn’t do it against those guys. We missed a couple third-and-1s and we missed a fourth-and-1. We are going to need everybody to be on top of their game, because we weren’t on top of our game the last time we played these guys."
By BOB LABRIOLA
PITTSBURGH – The running game has been an integral part of the foundation that was laid painstakingly by Coach Bill Cowher and his staff of assistants from the day the players reported for training camp at the end of July.
It has helped Ben Roethlisberger thrive as a rookie quarterback; it has helped the team control the clock; it has kept the defense off the field; it was the difference in the back-to-back decisive wins over New England and Philadelphia.
But as the Steelers prepare for a fortnight that holds consecutive road games against division opponents starting this Sunday in Cleveland, they are hurting where they have been so strong all season.
"We have a few bumps here going into this game," said Cowher.
Do they ever.
Duce Staley did not play against the Eagles because of a tender hamstring, and Cowher listed him as questionable for Sunday’s game in Cleveland because of that injury. Now, Staley will be joined on the injury report by Verron Haynes and Dan Kreider, and the Steelers may need to plug some holes in a part of their offense that had been punching big holes in opposing defenses.
Haynes starts the week listed as doubtful with a case of turf toe; Kreider is questionable with a hip flexor that prevented him from finishing the game against the Eagles last Sunday. All of a sudden, Willie Parker and Matt Cushing find themselves as the guys who may be next to be asked to step up and replace a front-line player without allowing for a drop-off in performance by the unit as a whole.
"It seems that every week, there is somebody new stepping up," said Cowher. "There have been some constants and you have to have good solid play from a lot of players. But when other people have had to step in, they have stepped in and we never missed a beat. It goes back all the way back to the training camp element of it, and there is going to be more down the road. Like I said before, everybody has a role and some guys would like to be a little more involved, but they have put the team before themselves. They recognize that when a guy gets hurt, you have to be ready to seize that opportunity.
"We have had a number of players who have been able to do that."
It started with Keydrick Vincent for Kendall Simmons, who sustained a season-ending knee injury back on Aug. 15. The most recent example was Jerome Bettis, who carried 33 times and rushed for 149 yards against the Eagles after Staley was made inactive because of his hamstring.
When everyone in the backfield is healthy, Staley is the starter, and Bettis is the short-yardage/goal-line specialist; Kreider is the fullback, and Haynes is the third-down back.
Cowher said that if Kreider cannot play, Cushing would get first crack at the starting fullback job, but the team also signed J.T. Wall to the practice squad as insurance. Wall was a No. 7 draft choice in 2003, who spent that season on the practice squad and was waived on the final cut this year after a respectable showing at training camp this summer. Cowher also said Parker is the top candidate to be the third-down back if Haynes cannot play.
Depending upon how much the injured players can heal during the week, Cowher could find himself with some interesting game day decisions in Cleveland. Resting Staley for the sake of saving him doesn’t seem to be an option he is considering.
"This is a very important game," said Cowher. "I think they are all important games. At the same time, you have to look at the big picture, and we will continue to take both of those into account and see where Duce is and go from there. We are not in any position to be resting anybody. There is such a fine line in this business, and we are playing with a little bit of an edge right now and we can’t lose that. You can lose it quickly in this business.
"It starts with our preparation and Sundays have been a reflection of how we prepare. We have to put together a good week of work and having to deal with the added obstacle of the noise, the atmosphere we are going into, we need everybody who can go in this football game."
The heartening aspect of this is that there is nothing wrong with the Steelers offensive line, and it has been the play of that unit that’s really been the difference of late. It’s ridiculous to assert that anyone could gain big yards running behind the Steelers offensive line, but it’s also foolish to underestimate the impact those guys are having right now.
If it’s necessary, Cowher believes Bettis can carry the ball 33 more times in Cleveland.
"We are not going to change," said Cowher. "We have to have some healthy backs. I think I named about every back that we have on injury list except Willie Parker, so he better get himself ready to play. But if we have to, Jerome played very well and our line did a good job.
"But don’t take anything away from the way that he ran against the Eagles, because Jerome Bettis ran very well. He made a lot of guys miss. He got a lot of yardage after the initial contact, but the line did a super job again and it is going to take another big effort because this Browns team has been a grind to run the football against. "I know the last time we played them, we had a lot of the same circumstances that we have had the last couple of weeks -- opportunities to run out the clock with the lead, and we couldn’t do it against those guys. We missed a couple third-and-1s and we missed a fourth-and-1. We are going to need everybody to be on top of their game, because we weren’t on top of our game the last time we played these guys."
More info on this game than you could imagine...
http://www.steelers.com/MediaContent/2004/11/09/11/Steelers_Notes_For_BrownsGame_46944.pdf
http://www.steelers.com/MediaContent/2004/11/09/11/Steelers_Notes_For_BrownsGame_46944.pdf
Steelers have no problem staying focused
November 11, 2004
By Teresa Varley
After two straight weeks of playing undefeated teams the Steelers face a new challenge this week – a team with a losing record. But that doesn’t matter to the black and gold. The Browns record is 3-5, but beating them is just as important and can be just as tough as beating the Patriots and the Eagles.<?XML:NAMESPACE PREFIX = O /><O
></O>
“Right now how we are approaching it is we are taking it one game at a time,” said cornerback Deshea Townsend. “We have to take it one week at a time. You can’t look forward. Every game you play you have to perform and that’s what we try to do.<O></O>
“We want to win every game that we play, but by it being Cleveland it just makes you get prepared that much more.”<O></O>
It would be easy for a team to suffer a letdown after having the two big wins the Steelers had. But inside the Steelers locker room, you won’t hear talk about big wins. You’ll just hear talk about what needs to be accomplished.<O></O>
“Everybody has been hungry,” said running back Jerome Bettis. “Everybody is practicing hard. You can’t tell that the team is on a roll right now. All you can see is guys working their butts off.”<O></O>
And other teams might be working a bit harder these days to now knock off the Steelers, the team that now has the target on their backs.
“You just have to go out there and not stop preparing,” said Townsend. “You have to keep doing the little things. That’s what could happen to teams that have the target on them, they stop doing the things that got them there. That’s something we have to not do.”<O></O>
* * *
The Steelers defense has been a major strength for the team so far, but it’s not the look many thought the defense would have at the midway through the season. Chris Hoke is starting at nose tackle for Casey Hampton, who was placed on injured reserve. Larry Foote is starting at inside linebacker for Kendrell Bell, who just returned to the field against the Eagles after missing the first seven weeks with a sports hernia. And Willie Williams is now starting at cornerback for Chad Scott, who was injured against the Cowboys.
The success the defense has had with the revamped lineup is something the players expected. <O></O>
“It doesn’t surprise me a bit,” said defensive end Aaron Smith. “We watch these guys practice every day and see what they are doing. We know when they stepped in there they could fill those shoes. We haven’t missed a beat with them in there.”
* * * <O></O>
With the Steelers injury report reading like a who’s who of NFL running backs, Bettis is getting a lot more carries in practice, in addition to the ones he got against the Eagles on Sunday. But after the day he had Sunday, he doesn’t mind.
“It was a lot of fun,” said Bettis. “I was fresh and it felt good and I really wanted to go out there and play well for my teammates.”<O></O>
If needed, Bettis said he could handle another 33-carry day against the Browns this Sunday.<O></O>
“It’s not a problem,” said Bettis. “I can do that. Monday’s won’t be very fun, but I can go out there and get it done. It’s one of those things that it’s a necessary evil. It feels bad but in your mind you feel good about it. I felt good I was banged up and beat up. I know then that I got a lot of work.”
November 11, 2004
By Teresa Varley
After two straight weeks of playing undefeated teams the Steelers face a new challenge this week – a team with a losing record. But that doesn’t matter to the black and gold. The Browns record is 3-5, but beating them is just as important and can be just as tough as beating the Patriots and the Eagles.<?XML:NAMESPACE PREFIX = O /><O
></O>“Right now how we are approaching it is we are taking it one game at a time,” said cornerback Deshea Townsend. “We have to take it one week at a time. You can’t look forward. Every game you play you have to perform and that’s what we try to do.<O
></O>“We want to win every game that we play, but by it being Cleveland it just makes you get prepared that much more.”<O
></O>It would be easy for a team to suffer a letdown after having the two big wins the Steelers had. But inside the Steelers locker room, you won’t hear talk about big wins. You’ll just hear talk about what needs to be accomplished.<O
></O>“Everybody has been hungry,” said running back Jerome Bettis. “Everybody is practicing hard. You can’t tell that the team is on a roll right now. All you can see is guys working their butts off.”<O
></O>And other teams might be working a bit harder these days to now knock off the Steelers, the team that now has the target on their backs.
“You just have to go out there and not stop preparing,” said Townsend. “You have to keep doing the little things. That’s what could happen to teams that have the target on them, they stop doing the things that got them there. That’s something we have to not do.”<O
></O>* * *
The Steelers defense has been a major strength for the team so far, but it’s not the look many thought the defense would have at the midway through the season. Chris Hoke is starting at nose tackle for Casey Hampton, who was placed on injured reserve. Larry Foote is starting at inside linebacker for Kendrell Bell, who just returned to the field against the Eagles after missing the first seven weeks with a sports hernia. And Willie Williams is now starting at cornerback for Chad Scott, who was injured against the Cowboys.
The success the defense has had with the revamped lineup is something the players expected. <O
></O>“It doesn’t surprise me a bit,” said defensive end Aaron Smith. “We watch these guys practice every day and see what they are doing. We know when they stepped in there they could fill those shoes. We haven’t missed a beat with them in there.”
* * * <O
></O>With the Steelers injury report reading like a who’s who of NFL running backs, Bettis is getting a lot more carries in practice, in addition to the ones he got against the Eagles on Sunday. But after the day he had Sunday, he doesn’t mind.
“It was a lot of fun,” said Bettis. “I was fresh and it felt good and I really wanted to go out there and play well for my teammates.”<O
></O>If needed, Bettis said he could handle another 33-carry day against the Browns this Sunday.<O
></O>“It’s not a problem,” said Bettis. “I can do that. Monday’s won’t be very fun, but I can go out there and get it done. It’s one of those things that it’s a necessary evil. It feels bad but in your mind you feel good about it. I felt good I was banged up and beat up. I know then that I got a lot of work.”
Hey B&G yep I (for once) actually enjoyed the trip. The woman was all decked out in her Swann jersey and she got to meet Jaws at a hotel bar in Station Square the night before the game. I was entertaining her relatives and making the rounds every time I go out there so I missed it. I was PISSED when I found out she met Jaws. That is my luck though the whole weekend with the Birds getting thumped was just bad news. Good to be back in my own neck of the woods.
The fans were good...they could tell I was in enough pain as it was.:coffeetim sb
LetsRoll said:Steelers have no problem staying focused
November 11, 2004
By Teresa Varley
After two straight weeks of playing undefeated teams the Steelers face a new challenge this week – a team with a losing record. But that doesn’t matter to the black and gold. The Browns record is 3-5, but beating them is just as important and can be just as tough as beating the Patriots and the Eagles.<?XML:NAMESPACE PREFIX = O /><O
“Right now how we are approaching it is we are taking it one game at a time,” said cornerback Deshea Townsend. “We have to take it one week at a time. You can’t look forward. Every game you play you have to perform and that’s what we try to do.<O
“We want to win every game that we play, but by it being Cleveland it just makes you get prepared that much more.”<O
It would be easy for a team to suffer a letdown after having the two big wins the Steelers had. But inside the Steelers locker room, you won’t hear talk about big wins. You’ll just hear talk about what needs to be accomplished.<O
“Everybody has been hungry,” said running back Jerome Bettis. “Everybody is practicing hard. You can’t tell that the team is on a roll right now. All you can see is guys working their butts off.”<O
And other teams might be working a bit harder these days to now knock off the Steelers, the team that now has the target on their backs.
“You just have to go out there and not stop preparing,” said Townsend. “You have to keep doing the little things. That’s what could happen to teams that have the target on them, they stop doing the things that got them there. That’s something we have to not do.”<O
* * *
The Steelers defense has been a major strength for the team so far, but it’s not the look many thought the defense would have at the midway through the season. Chris Hoke is starting at nose tackle for Casey Hampton, who was placed on injured reserve. Larry Foote is starting at inside linebacker for Kendrell Bell, who just returned to the field against the Eagles after missing the first seven weeks with a sports hernia. And Willie Williams is now starting at cornerback for Chad Scott, who was injured against the Cowboys.
The success the defense has had with the revamped lineup is something the players expected. <O
“It doesn’t surprise me a bit,” said defensive end Aaron Smith. “We watch these guys practice every day and see what they are doing. We know when they stepped in there they could fill those shoes. We haven’t missed a beat with them in there.”
* * * <O
With the Steelers injury report reading like a who’s who of NFL running backs, Bettis is getting a lot more carries in practice, in addition to the ones he got against the Eagles on Sunday. But after the day he had Sunday, he doesn’t mind.
“It was a lot of fun,” said Bettis. “I was fresh and it felt good and I really wanted to go out there and play well for my teammates.”<O
If needed, Bettis said he could handle another 33-carry day against the Browns this Sunday.<O
“It’s not a problem,” said Bettis. “I can do that. Monday’s won’t be very fun, but I can go out there and get it done. It’s one of those things that it’s a necessary evil. It feels bad but in your mind you feel good about it. I felt good I was banged up and beat up. I know then that I got a lot of work.”
good read thanks....Parker will be helping the bus in the backfield and alan fanaca one of the all pro guards for pitt says parker is FAST and can cut to the outside very fast...I do not think pitt Run game will die out against a bad cleveland team
but who knows I still like the Cleveland +3.5 a bit
