So, like I said, I would never have used the #11. But the #8 was useable. Not as the key horse but useable. He has a decent trainer and I've learned to look back at the workouts for the first timers. The trainers seem to get a good workout then lay off for a few workouts before putting him on the track. This is a longshot signal only. If you look back five workouts to 1/7 you will see that his workout was the second fastest of horses who worked out that day. That's my longshot signal right there for first time starters with lesser trainers. I would have used him but all for naught. Couldn't have had the #11.