Indianapolis Colts News

[soccerbob]

Vanderjagt should have kept his mouth shut for two reasons. First, dirty laundry should be kept in the team basket and secondly; Vanderjagt had a poor year so he should have kept quiet.

Peyton Manning has never won a big game in the NFL. He's way too soft and calls too many audibles at the line. That's why the offense has no rhythem at all. Tony Dungy is a very overrated coach and that's why this team will continue to go nowhere.

 

[TheGeneral+]

TERRE HAUTE, Ind. -- The end of training camp at Rose-Hulman Institute of Technology doesn’t mean training camp has ended for the Colts.

After playing host to the Seattle Seahawks Friday night in the RCA Dome, the team sets up shop at the Union Federal Football Center in Indianapolis. All practices at the team headquarters are closed to the public.

“We still have some things to work on,’’ coach Tony Dungy said after this morning’s light workout, the final this summer at Rose-Hulman. “We will be back in a more normal environment, but we still have one week of training camp to go.’’

The Colts will remain in “camp mode’’ as they prepare for their third preseason game, an Aug. 25 trip to Denver. After that, they will begin focusing on the Sept. 7 regular-season opener at Cleveland.

QUOTE TO NOTE: "I was never behind from day one. I got the playbook when they got me and told me I was their pick. I feel like I am on the same page as everybody. I don’t know how much I will be out there (against Seattle), but I know that once I’m out there on the field I’m going to work hard and do everything I can to help us win.’’ – rookie safety Mike Doss.

INJURY UPDATE: At least 10 players will not play against Seattle. The list includes quarterback Brock Huard (finger), running backs Dominic Rhodes (knee), Ricky Williams (knee) and James Mungro (ribs), cornerbacks Walt Harris (knee) and Donald Strickland (groin), linebackers Rob Morris (knee) and Jim Nelson (hand), wide receiver Brandon Stokley (foot) and defensive end Robert Mathis (knee).

Tight end Marcus Pollard (groin), defensive tackle Montae Reagor (groin) and cornerbacks Nick Harper (ankle) and Cliff Crosby (ankle) will be game-time decisions.

ROSTER MOVE: The team signed defensive back Travis Coleman, who most recently played with Berlin in NFL Europe.

http://www.indystar.com/print/articles/9/065221-1299-094.html

 

[TheGeneral+]

This time, the Indianapolis Colts defense got it right.

Playing without three starters Friday night at the RCA Dome, the first string went seven series and permitted Seattle three first downs. The Seahawks ran 26 plays over that first 22 minutes. They gained 67 yards and were shut out.

"It was especially nice to see us defensively get the ball back for our offense a few times," said coach Tony Dungy, who was dissatisfied with his team's defensive execution last week, when the Colts lost their preseason opener to Chicago 20-18. "I think we played with some good energy."

Friday's 21-7 loss was a feeble performance for a capable Seattle offense. Running back Shaun Alexander rushed for 1,175 yards and an NFC-leading 16 touchdowns last season. Quarterback Matt Hasselbeck passed for more than 3,000 yards while starting only 10 games.

The Colts blitzed frequently and dominated. Defensive end Dwight Freeney and outside linebacker Marcus Washington recorded sacks and the defense relentlessly pressured first Hasselbeck, then Seneca Wallace.

Before yielding to the reserves, the starters produced turnovers that set up the Colts' first touchdown and spiked Seattle's most promising early drive. Freeney set up the first when he knocked the football loose while sacking Hasselbeck for an 18-yard loss on the game's opening series. Tackle Brad Scioli recovered at the Seattle 28-yard line.

Colts end Raheem Brock made a spectacular play for the second turnover. With the Seahawks facing first-and-goal at the Colts 9, Brock leaped to tip a Wallace pass, then went back up to make the interception.

"We work on that play a lot, so I read the screen," said Brock. "And the quarterback's kind of short, so I got a hand on the ball."

Reserve cornerback David Macklin later recovered a Wallace fumble in the end zone for the Colts' final touchdown.

The defense's five takeaways pushed its total to eight through two games.

'Edge' sits it out

Brian Allen wanted the football. Edgerrin James was only too happy to see it given to him.

Dungy said Thursday that James would go about 20 plays but decided on Friday not to put James at risk when the starting running back's hamstring bothered him during warm-ups. James, who makes no effort to conceal his disdain for the preseason, watched from the bench, wearing shorts, a sports shirt and a backward Colts cap.

"I did a lot of running this week taking extra reps. My leg was a little tired," said James, who added that he would have played had it been a regular-season game.

Reserve running backs Ricky Williams (knee) and James Mungro (ribs) were injured last week against Chicago. The Colts' only other options besides James and Allen were two free agents acquired this week, Montrell Lowe and Mike Green.

Allen rushed 20 times for 62 yards.

James, who had four carries against the Bears, did not play during the preseason last year, when he was coming off reconstructive knee surgery. James led the NFL in rushing in 1999 and 2000.

Meadows plays swingman

Adam Meadows, supplanted at right tackle this week by Ryan Diem, had a busy night. Meadows was in for Tarik Glenn at left tackle during the Colts' second series and later played on the right side, too.

Meadows will back up both positions, but he hadn't played the left side since his rookie season in 1997.

Injuries

Special teams standout Donnel Thompson suffered the Colts' most serious injury when he sprained his right knee midway through the second quarter. X-rays were taken, but Thompson said, "We don't know how serious it is yet," before hobbling from the locker room on crutches. Tight end Marcus Pollard strained a calf muscle and cornerback Joseph Jefferson left during the second quarter with a sore groin muscle, but neither injury was thought to be serious.

http://www.indystar.com/print/articles/3/065789-3033-036.html

 

[TheGeneral+]

TERRE HAUTE, Ind. - They arrived late, but when the Indianapolis Colts headed home from training camp Thursday, Mike Doss and Dallas Clark were right where they expected to be.

Clark, the Colts' first-round draft pick out of Iowa, had begun to entrench himself as the team's No. 2 tight end. Doss, the Colts' second-round pick, was working his way up in the defensive rotations.

It was exactly what the Colts wanted to see in the first three weeks of their professional careers.

"We don't want it to be hard, we want it to be productive," coach Tony Dungy said Thursday. "We want it to be a learning experience for our rookies."

The first journey through training camp for Doss and Clark was both educational and occasionally enjoyable.

In the last week, they also began to make an impression.

Clark caught three passes for 54 yards in the Colts' 20-18 loss against Chicago on Saturday and showed his elusiveness in the open field - one of the skills that was attractive to Indianapolis scouts.

Doss nearly intercepted a pass near the goal line late in Wednesday's afternoon practice, a play that likely would have been run back for a touchdown - had he held on. He was in position to make another interceptions during Thursday morning's final workout.

The players will have meetings Thursday afternoon and Friday morning before returning to Indianapolis.

And, of course, there were the usual growing pains.

"They always say the biggest difference is the speed and the caliber of athlete," Doss said. "You've got Marvin Harrison on one side and Reggie Wayne on the other and Brandon Stokley in the slot. When you've got that caliber of athlete it takes a little bit to adjust."

For Doss, training camp was expected to be more of a catch-up lesson.

He'd missed all the Colts summer school workouts because NFL rules prohibit players from attending mini-camps if classes are in session at their school. Doss managed to make it only to one three-day mandatory mini-camp the weekend after the draft and a three-day rookie camp just before players reported to Rose-Hulman Institute of Technology.

Still, Doss said he never believed he was behind and believes he will continue to progress.

Dungy said he expected Doss to play early in Friday night's game.

Clark attended all of the team's offseason mini-camps but reported six days late while his contract was settled. He said he has had little trouble learning the offense but acknowledged he used camp to get into "football shape."

Perhaps, most important, was that after two weeks of work, he was beginning to feel comfortable in the Colts offense.

"It would be nice to be 100 percent comfortable out there," he said. "But I'm definitely in a situation where I'm pretty confident with where I'm at."

The Colts believe their top two draft picks are right where they belong.

"It's been great, very productive," Dungy said. "We got done what we wanted to, and I like where we are right now."

http://www.miami.com/mld/miamiherald/sports/6533644.htm

 

[TheGeneral+]

INDIANAPOLIS - Barring injury, Edgerrin James is the one back in the Indianapolis Colts' one-back offense.

There is no argument in the Colts' locker room on that point. That's the way it has been since James arrived and became the NFL rushing champion and Offensive Rookie of the Year in 1999 and that's the way it still is.

The bulk of the snaps and carries belong to him when the regular season starts.

But the battle to become James' chief understudy for the 2003 season is being fought by some talented backs looking to earn their spot on the Colts' depth chart in the team's final two preseason games.

James Mungro, Ricky Williams, Dominic Rhodes, Brian Allen and Mike Green are all part of the crowded contest. Mungro, Williams and Rhodes are all battling through preseason injuries that are keeping them off the field as Allen and Green carry on.

"Right now, we have some guys banged up and battling back from injuries, but we think this position is very deep and there's a lot of competition," said Mungro, who was the Colts' second-leading rusher with 336 yards on 97 carries last season.

Mungro and Rhodes are ruled out Monday against Denver with their respective knee injuries. Colts coach Tony Dungy said Williams, recovering from a knee sprain, could play if he continues to improve.

"It's coming along better than I thought it would be," said Williams, a second-year player from Texas Tech acquired before last season in a trade with New Orleans.

Second-year back Brian Allen, who missed all of his rookie season with a knee injury and ensuing surgery, has taken advantage of his chance to make an impact on the field while the others have struggled through injuries.

Allen leads the Colts in rushing this preseason with 136 yards on 28 carries for a 4.9-yard rushing average. He also has six receptions for 23 yards.

"I'm just trying to get a lot of game experience in," he said.

Rhodes rushed for 1,104 yards and nine touchdowns in the final 10 games of the 2001 season following James' injury. Plans to use the two in tandem at times last season were scrapped when Rhodes went down with a knee injury of his own during the preseason and he followed Allen to the injured reserve list.

Rhodes had been expected to be the primary backup and occasional backfield mate for James again, but Rhodes' recovery from knee surgery has not gone as well as anticipated. That has left more playing time for Allen and now Green, who spent three seasons with Tennessee before being released in the offseason.

Dungy said Green has been impressive in practice and could see action against Denver. Green still holds the rushing record for NFL Europe with 1,057 yards for Barcelona.

With Rhodes out last season and James struggling through assorted injuries, Mungro got his first professional start at Philadelphia and rushed for 114 yards and a pair of touchdowns in the Colts' 35-13 victory over the Eagles.

Mungro, then a rookie from Syracuse who had been cut by Detroit during training camp, was filling in not only for James in that game, but also for Williams. Williams, the scheduled starter, was out with a hamstring injury.

The injury bug followed the backfield into this season, but could make for a healthy competition when everyone recovers.

"I believe were going to have one of the most competitive backfields this year," said Allen. "I'm just going to pray for them that they get back healthy and then that I'm going to accomplish what I can do."

http://www.miami.com/mld/miamiherald/sports/6596243.htm

 

[TheGeneral+]

(Sports Network) - It’s playoff glory or bust for the Indianapolis Colts this year. For all of the individual success of Peyton Manning, Marvin Harrison, and Edgerrin James, the Colts are 25-25 including playoff games since the start of the 2000 season.

The trio takes up too much of the salary cap for .500 results. Manning reached new heights, Harrison shattered the single-season receptions record and the team improved by four games in Tony Dungy’s initial season as Indy's head coach, but any good feelings were wiped out when the Colts were annihilated by a 41-0 count in the playoffs against the Jets.

James is healthy after 2001 knee surgery and the Colts have a deeper core of receivers. The weapons are there. Manning has to cut down on his turnovers or his partnership with James and Harrison will be dissolved, something that was unthinkable in 1999.

While Dungy left the offense alone last year, he brought Ron Meeks in to install his defense. The result was a statistical improvement from 29th in total defense, to eighth. The first-round selection of Dwight Freeney was a perfect fit for the defense. He gave the Colts their best pass-rushing threat in decades and helped improve the speed of the defense.

As much as the defense flourished in Dungy’s Cover-2 system, turnovers were still scarce. The Colts picked off just 10 passes last year, and LB Mike Peterson, the team leader with three picks, was allowed to leave as a free agent. In Dungy’s final two seasons in Tampa his defense’s intercepted 25 passes each year and caused a total of 78 turnovers.

For the Colts to continue to improve, Dungy knows creating more turnovers is the key.

"There’s no way we’re going to be efficient with eight or nine interceptions over the course of a year," Dungy said. "Guys really have to increase their standards. We talk about 32 being two a game -- that’s a minimum. Realistically, 40 is what you’re looking for."

Without a playoff victory, Dungy is likely to be looking at some new faces on offense next year.

OFFENSE

Peyton Manning has started every game since being the top pick in the 1998 draft. His 80-game streak is the longest ever to start a career, and is the second-longest active streak behind Brett Favre. He’s never thrown less than 26 touchdowns and has four consecutive seasons of 4,000 or more passing yards. He’s a player the league spotlights as a role model and spokesman and has no scandals on his resume despite a life spent in the public eye. So what’s not to love?

Mainly the zero postseason wins. Manning has been somewhat bulletproof because he’s a good guy and cooperative with the media, but each season the Colts go home without a postseason win, the doubts grow about Manning’s value despite the gaudy stats.

At a time when the West Coast offense proliferates, Manning takes more chances downfield. More interceptions have been the result. Manning was picked off 19 times last year and 23 in 2001. For his career he has a 1.38-to-1 TD-to-INT ratio. Those are numbers straight out of the 1970s when his dad Archie was playing.

Last year’s Super Bowl quarterbacks, Rich Gannon and Brad Johnson, combined for 48 TDs and 16 picks, a 3-to-1 ratio. Manning has an above-average arm; it’s just not as good as he thinks it is.

Thankfully he seemed to cut back on calling plays over center. His continued use hurt the Colts as much as it helped by making the linemen remain set for extended periods. That said, Manning still does a whole lot more right than wrong and is certainly capable of erasing any doubts about his ability to win a big game.

He’ll be helped by a healthy James, who said he feels better than at any time since his 2001 surgery. James came back to rush for 989 yards but he clearly lacked the acceleration he displayed in his first two seasons. His longest run of the year was only 20 yards and he rushed for just two touchdowns. James is also one of the best receiving backs in the league.

Dominic Rhodes was sensational when James was injured in 2001, but he missed all of last season because of knee surgery and has been injured during camp. If healthy he’ll back up James and the two may even play together this year as the Colts have experimented with a two-back set. James Mungro took over as James’ backup last season and scored eight touchdowns. James should again get the ball at the goal line this year, but Mungro provides depth if Rhodes is out for an extended time. FB Donnel Thompson is out for the year after he tore the ACL in his right knee.

How ridiculous are the numbers Marvin Harrison has put up over the last four seasons? He has averaged 117 catches, 1,580 yards and 13 TDs over that time. Reggie Wayne made big strides in his second season and could also reach the 1,000-yard mark. He had 716 yards last year and led the Colts with a 14.6 average. Qadry Ismail didn’t work out last year, but the Colts have turned to another former Baltimore Raven this year. Brandon Stokley will be the slot receiver and has the speed to make plays against nickel defenders.

Marcus Pollard has been a good TE for the Colts, catching 14 TDs the last two years, but he could see his production dip in his ninth season. The Colts surprised almost everyone when they selected TE Dallas Clark in the first round. A new toy for Manning seemed a luxury when the defense needed to improve, but Clark should help the offense immediately.

At 6-foot-3 and 253 pounds, Clark has excellent speed and hands and can be a matchup nightmare. His arrival should mean a return to the two-tight end sets the Colts featured when they had Ken Dilger and Pollard. Clark, in his debut, on the first pass thrown to him, caught the ball, turned upfield and leveled Bears Pro Bowl LB Brian Urlacher. Shockey-like? Not really, he had no plans afterward to insult former coach Jim Mora in Indianapolis Monthly.

Manning is accustomed to good protection. For his career he’s only been dumped once per every 26 pass attempts. He’ll have some new players in front of him this season though. RG Ryan Diem has been moved to RT and could unseat long time starter Adam Meadows. Rookie fourth-rounder Steve Sciullo would then be the starter at RG. Jeff Saturday is a top-tier center. Rick DeMulling started 14 games at LG in his second season last year and will again team with Tarik Glenn on the left side. When Glenn tells Manning he’s got his back, he means it. Glenn has started every game at LT since being drafted in the first round in 1997 and has not missed a single snap over the past five seasons.

DEFENSE

Dwight Freeney was a terror last season, smashing any notion that he was too small to play DE in the NFL. The other knock on Freeney was that he was strictly a turf player and his speed would be neutralized on grass. Consider that theory debunked. Freeney was an equal-surface menace to opposing offenses. He recorded 13 sacks in 12 games and forced nine fumbles. Over his last seven regular season games he had 9.0 sacks and all nine FF. Freeney will play mainly on passing downs.

Reliable veteran Chad Bratzke will start at one end and Brad Scioli at the other. Both can also move inside when Freeney is in the game. Second-year man Larry Tripplett should start at DT. Scioli, Bratzke, and free-agent addition Montae Reagor will also rotate at DT.

Veteran linebacker Mike Peterson departed during free agency and will be replaced by David Thornton, a special teams standout with excellent speed. Rob Morris really developed in Dungy’s defense last year and will again man the middle. He had some knee problems during camp but is expected to be ready for the opener. Marcus Washington is the other OLB, but could yield to rookie Robert Mathis on passing downs. The fifth-round pick had 17 sacks as a defensive end at Alabama A&M last year. He’s got great speed and has set his goals high. Mathis wants to break the rookie sack record.

In the defensive backfield, veteran Walt Harris has one CB spot locked up. Nick Harper, an undrafted free agent in 2001, looks like he is ready to unseat David Macklin at the other corner. David Gibson, the player steamrolled by Jeremy Shockey last year, and Idrees Bashir return at safety with a mandate to get more turnovers.

SPECIAL TEAMS

Mike Vanderjagt is still the most accurate kicker in NFL history, cashing in better than 85 percent of his kicks. That explains why a PK can go on national television in Canada and rip his head coach and quarterback and still have a job. He apologized to both and the incident is supposedly history. Another performance like last year though and Vanderjagt won’t have the luxury of mouthing off about anyone. His performance slipped noticeably the past two seasons. Coming off of a very good, but not great 2001 season, Vanderjagt missed eight kicks last year. So good from 40 plus yards his first four seasons, Vanderjagt was only 6-of-12 from 40-to-49 yards out. Hunter Smith returns to handle punting duties. WR Troy Walters is the favorite to handle return duties.

COACHING

Tony Dungy handled the easy part; he improved team speed and morale after Jim Mora’s final season. The defense made strides to respectability. Improving to an elite level and creating the 40 turnovers Dungy wants will take a lot more work. Dungy’s been saddled with the same baggage as Manning, can’t win in the postseason. If the Colts don’t win a playoff game this season, one of the Big Three or Dungy won’t be around in 2004.

OUTLOOK

The Colts don’t have enough playmakers on defense to create the havoc Dungy wants. They’re also thin at LB and in the secondary. They have oodles of big- play threats on offense. For the Colts to take the next step, however, they need to carry the day. Manning has to cut down on the interceptions and spread the ball around efficiently. There’s no reason the Colts can’t score more than 400 points and be a top five scoring offense.

Indy was 0-5 including the playoff game when it scored less than 20 points last year. Good defense and bad days happen, but with all the tools the Colts have on offense a repeat of five sub 20-point performances is unacceptable. The Colts should battle the Titans for first place in the AFC South all season. They’re good enough to win the division and a playoff game, they just have to go out and do it.

http://sportsnetwork.com/default.asp?c=sportsnetwork&page=nfl/news/ABN2749438.htm

 

[TheGeneral+]

Watching D speed tonight. Colts look ok up front. Will get better as season goes. Nice core there.

 

[TheGeneral+]

The weather and the circumstances were different from the last time the Colts and Broncos met, but the results were the same. The Colts beat the Broncos 28-23 during the Monday Night game and never had to use kicker Mike Vanderjagt to win the game this time.

Last season Vanderjagt had to kick a 54-yard field goal in the snow and wind to win the game. This time there was no snow, or was there even a field goal kicked by the Colts. Both Vanderjagt and kicker Brett Conway were only used twice apiece to make extra points after touchdowns.

The game almost looked the same in the start as the Colts offense was dead on their first couple of drives and the Broncos were running all over the Colts defense. Denver was able to put three points on the board first after rookie linebacker Gary Brackett let a interception slip through his fingers and Broncos quarterback Jake Plummer missed a wide open Ed McCafferey in the end zone.


Indianapolis tried again to move the ball on their second drive, but the Broncos defense stopped everything thrown at them. Punter Hunter Smith was able to get the punt off after long snapper Justin Snow fumbled the snap on the first drive. On the first play of the Broncos drive, Plummer made rookie safety Mike Doss bite on the play action and then bombed a pass to wide receiver Ashley Lelie for a 55 yard touchdown.


That touchdown seemed to be the final excitement from the Broncos for the rest of the game. Indianapolis finally found their cohesiveness on their third drive getting majority of the plays to rookie tight end Dallas Clark. Manning connected with Clark on four passes including one being a 14 yard touchdown over the middle of the Broncos defense. Clark finished the game with five catches for 35 yards before leaving the game with a bruised left thigh in the second quarter.


Manning was not done with his Monday Night show, as the offense was quickly back on the filed after the defense finally settled down and forced the Broncos to punt. Backup running back Brian Allen caught a dump pass from Manning and turned up the field to scamper for a 53-yard touchdown. But Allen did not only score in the air, but also grabbed a touchdown on a four-yard run. Allen totaled 62 yards on three receptions and only 20 yards on 13 carries, but do not blame James for the poor rushing, as there were no holes what so ever to run through.


Finally Manning was pulled after throwing 15 for 22, 157 yard and two touchdowns. Rookie backup James MacPherson replaced Manning, but only played two series passing 2 for 4 and 3 yards. With not much movement, ex arena quarterback Jim Kubiak played the last series resulting in a nine-yard touch down pass to rookie wide receiver Aaron Moorehead. Kubiak threw a lobbing pass in the corner of the end zone, as Moorehead was able to jump over a Bronco defender.


The Colts were lead defensively by second year linebacker David Thornton with nine tackles and one sack. Indianapolis is looking for Thornton to fill in for released linebacker Mike Peterson who signed with the Jacksonville Jaguars. Thornton leads the Colts with 21 tackles during the preseason.


Coach Tony Dungy once again got his two interceptions a game goal. Rookie free agent Anthony Floyd released by Buffalo Bills and signed by the Colts intercepted a pass and making the fans boo Plummer off the field. Also, recently signed NFL European player Travis Coleman intercepted a pass from Danny Kanell. Cornerback Nick Harper was able to force a fumble from Mike Anderson, which was recovered by Marcus Washington. The Colts have now tallied a total of 11 turnovers thus far in the preseason.


But the players of the game have to be special teams. Punter Hunter Smith took advantage of the thin air in Denver, kicking for 278 yards for an average of 55.6. The punt cover team only allowed the Broncos to average 10.3 yards for four returns. Rookie Brad Pryatt opened eyes while returning four kicks for 100 yards with a long of 38.


With this game most likely being the final for many starters, it was more of a final try out for others. The Colts staff must trim their roster to 65 today (August 26th) from the current 80 players. The Colts will have a short rest, hosting the Cincinnati Bengals Friday August 29th at 7 P.M. kickoff for the final preseason game.


http://colts.theinsiders.com/2/172132.html

 

[TheGeneral+]

The kicking competition between Mike Vanderjagt and Brett Conway will go down to the wire.

After tonight's preseason finale against Cincinnati in the RCA Dome, the Colts must decide whether to stick with Vanderjagt, the most accurate field-goal kicker in NFL history, or go with Conway.

Ideally, the team would keep both and allow Conway, who has displayed a stronger leg during the preseason, to concentrate on kickoffs while Vanderjagt handles field goals.

"But in my mind, I don't think we will," coach Tony Dungy said after Thursday afternoon's practice. "I think we're going to have one kicker.

"We've got to make the right decision."

Vanderjagt has missed his three field-goal attempts during the preseason while Conway is 1-for-2. Neither attempted a field goal Monday night against Denver.

"Brett is a quality kicker and has kicked in the league," Dungy said. "Mike is a very quality kicker who has made a lot of big kicks for us.

"We're going to be in good hands no matter who we decide on."

Rhodes improving

Dominic Rhodes was upbeat in the locker room Thursday because he experienced positive work the previous day.

"It felt great (Wednesday) and feels real good today," the Colts' backup running back said of his surgically repaired right knee. "No pain, no nothing.

". . . I'm just going to keep on plugging away. That's the bottom line."

Rhodes, who tore the anterior cruciate ligament in his right knee during last summer's training camp, has missed the three preseason games, and he won't play tonight.

Dungy was encouraged by Rhodes' progress, and hasn't ruled him out for the regular-season opener at Cleveland.

"Before (Wednesday) I would have said, 'No way,' for Cleveland," he said. "But he gave me a little optimism."

The night off

At least nine players won't play against the Bengals.

The list includes running backs James Mungro (ribs) and Rhodes, cornerbacks Nick Harper (knee), Joseph Jefferson (groin) and Donald Strickland (groin), fullback Detron Smith (hamstring), linebacker Rob Morris (knee) and safeties Idrees Bashir (knee) and Cory Bird (shoulder).

Game-time decisions will be made on cornerback Walt Harris (knee), offensive tackle Adam Meadows (foot) and defensive lineman Chad Bratzke (foot).

Harris has not played since the preseason opener against Chicago.

"We'd like to get him 10 or 12 plays," Dungy said.

Back in action

Running back Ricky Williams and rookie defensive end Robert Mathis will see their first action since suffering knee injuries in the preseason opener against Chicago.

The team believes Mathis, its fourth-round draft pick, can make immediate contributions as a pass rusher in its nickel package. But his development was slowed when he suffered torn cartilage in his right knee against the Bears.

Williams sprained the medial collateral ligament in his right knee.

Where's the buzz?

Despite the arrival of Marvin Lewis as head coach in January, Bengals fans apparently are maintaining a wait-and-see attitude.

Cincinnati's Sept. 7 home opener against Denver still isn't a sellout.

"As I said a long time ago, everybody has that one foot in (the stadium) and they're just not quite sure," Lewis told the Cincinnati media. "They don't want to buy in.

"That sounds familiar, doesn't it? That's just human nature."

It's certainly understandable. The last time the Bengals posted a winning record was in 1990 (9-7). They were a league-worst 2-14 in 2002 and have lost at least 10 games for five consecutive seasons.

Dorsch in the running

One of the decisions the Bengals must make is at punter. Former Purdue standout Travis Dorsch has spent the preseason battling incumbent Nick Harris.

After three games, it's no contest. Dorsch, a fourth-round draft pick a year ago, has averaged 47.8 yards, with a net of 39.0, on five punts. Harris has averaged 36.4 with a net of 26.6.

http://www.indystar.com/print/articles/0/069611-2450-036.html

 

[TheGeneral+]

When the Pro Bowl votes were announced last December, the Tennessee Titans were in the midst of a streak of 10 wins in 11 games that gave them the AFC South title.

Yet they had no one voted to the NFL's all-star game, not even quarterback Steve McNair, who ended up third in league MVP voting.

"I'm quite sure a lot of players on this team deserved it, but that's how it works," McNair said at the time. "It's a team thing now for us. To solve all this, we just got to go to the Super Bowl and win it."

They didn't, but they came close, losing 41-24 in the AFC championship game in Oakland. Now they're trying one more time to reach the game they almost won four years ago when Kevin Dyson was stopped a yard short of the tying touchdown against St. Louis.

The Titans should win the division again. Only Indianapolis seems equipped to challenge in a division that also includes schizophrenic Jacksonville and Houston, in its second season back in the league.

With McNair, perhaps the NFL's best combination runner-passer at quarterback - sorry, Michael Vick and Donovan McNabb - the Titans have a shot at the title. In fact, the whole offense seems solid, unusual for a team whose success has been built on defense.

Running back Eddie George, hampered by injuries the past few years, has looked better in camp, although he's slowed a bit. But his eventual successor might be on hand: rookie Chris Brown, who's been hampered by a hamstring problem, but has the speed that George has lost.

Wide receivers Derrick Mason and Drew Bennett and tight end Frank Wycheck provide talented targets for McNair, who passed for 3,387 yards and 22 TDs last season and ran for 440 more, second behind George. But Wycheck is dealing with a concussion.

With all that, the key may be the health of defensive end Jevon Kearse. He set a rookie record for sacks in 1999, the Super Bowl season, but hasn't been completely healthy since. This year, he's had a sprained ankle, but if he can shake that off, he and the up-and-down Kevin Carter should put the kind of pressure on opposing quarterbacks the Titans haven't had for a while.

The linebacking corps is deep, led by Keith Bulluck, another Titan who should have been a Pro Bowler.

And the much-exploited secondary also seems set with oft-injured Samari Rolle healthy and strong safety Tank Williams coming on in his second year.

On to Houston on Feb. 1?

"We've accomplished what we needed to accomplish in camp," coach Jeff Fisher said. "This in a lot of ways is a defining moment for us."

The defining moment for the Colts came last January when, after earning a wild-card spot at 10-6, they were embarrassed 41-0 by the Jets in the playoffs. The defense, which went from 29th in the NFL in yards allowed to eighth, had a problem with New York teams - two weeks earlier, it allowed 44 points to the Giants.

But offense the Colts' strength, especially with Edgerrin James in his second season back from major knee surgery and seemingly the same player who led the NFL in rushing his first two seasons. Add in Marvin Harrison, whose 143 receptions last year shattered the NFL record and, of course, Peyton Manning throwing, and the offense is one of the league's best.

Ah, but that defense.

Dwight Freeney, last year's top draft pick, came on and finished with 13 sacks, although he still has to work on his run defense. And when general manager Bill Polian says: "We can challenge if none of our top five guys get hurt," Freeney is the only defensive guy he lists in his top five.

This year's most impressive new defender may be strong safety Michael Doss, the second-round draft pick.

Jacksonville (6-10 last season) seems to be starting anew with Jack Del Rio replacing Tom Coughlin, the only coach the Jaguars had since they entered the league in 1995. Among the signs: use of their first-round draft pick on quarterback Byron Leftwich, who will replace Mark Brunell in the next year or two.

But how then to explain the signing of the likes of Hugh Douglas and J.J. Stokes?

Douglas, one of the best pass rushers in the NFL over the last eight years, had 12 1/2 sacks for Philadelphia last year.

But neither the Eagles nor other contenders were willing to meet the price of the 32-year-old defensive end with bad knees, and he landed with the Jaguars. So did wide receiver Stokes after being cut by San Francisco for salary cap reasons.

Two negatives early: Jimmy Smith, the top receiver, has been suspended four games for testing positive for an illegal substance, and running back Fred Taylor's knee is bothering him.

Houston had a respectable first season back, winning four games, including an opening-night victory over neighboring Dallas and wins over two playoff teams in Pittsburgh and the New York Giants.

The Texans also found a long-term quarterback in David Carr, the first overall pick in last year's draft. But how much of a pounding can Carr take, even at age 24? Last season, he was sacked a league-record 76 times and the offensive line could be even worse this season.

The Texans' strength is defense, befitting a team coached by Dom Capers, who got Carolina to the NFC championship game in its second season. Cornerback Aaron Glenn and defensive tackle Gary Walker were Pro Bowlers last season.

---

Prediction: Tennessee (11-5); Indianapolis (10-6); Houston (4-12); Jacksonville (4-12).


http://therxforum.com/6/ubb.x?a=prply&s=100090022&f=366092022&m=8033012217

 

[rustey]

hi im am a newly registered member and i have been watching this site for some time, i have seen that the General is a great poster but i think i can sum everything up so we will all under stand what he is saying
THE COLTS SUCK

 

[TheGeneral+]

Welcome to The Rx rustey. LOL

It's all good

 

[TheGeneral+]

A telephone call that Mike Vanderjagt never anticipated never came Sunday afternoon.

Fifteen teammates -- ex-teammates -- weren't as fortunate.

On an afternoon that saw the Indianapolis Colts trim their roster to the NFL-mandated 53 by waiving 15 players, Vanderjagt was left alone. He, not preseason challenger Brett Conway, once again will serve as the team's place-kicker in Sunday's regular-season opener at Cleveland.

"I never really thought I'd get a phone call saying, 'You know what? We're just not going to go with you this year,' " Vanderjagt said. "I never really looked at it as a competition (with Conway).

"I never thought I was going anywhere."

Vanderjagt's confidence was rudimentary and not a knock on Conway. It certainly wasn't shaken after he missed all three of his field-goal attempts during the preseason.

"I'm pretty good at what I do," he said.

Coach Tony Dungy seemed to indicate there wasn't a lengthy debate on the Vanderjagt-Conway issue.

"He's kicked well for us in the past. He's made big kicks," Dungy said of Vanderjagt. "We didn't see any decline in his ability. We felt Mike was better for us at this point."

That's what drove Sunday's decisions, arriving at the best possible 53 players.

Short-term injuries to several players complicated the trimming process, most notably at running back and in the secondary. The Colts kept six backs, including ailing Dominic Rhodes and James Mungro, and 11 defensive backs.

Dungy said the surplus of DBs "is not something we set out to do but felt we had to because of the injuries at corner."

There were a couple of minor surprises in Sunday's reduction.

Among the casualties were David Gibson, a nine-game starter at strong safety a year ago; defensive lineman Josh Mallard, a seventh-round draft pick in 2002 who saw action in 13 games as a rookie; and two of this year's eight-player draft class -- linebacker Keyon Whiteside, a fifth-round pick, and offensive lineman Makoa Freitas, a sixth-rounder.

Gibson lost his starting spot to rookie Mike Doss but thought he had taken steps to secure a roster spot when he agreed to move from strong safety to weak-side linebacker two weeks ago.

"I was led to believe what I was doing was in the best interest of the team," he said. "I was wrong. It really didn't matter.

"In this profession, something like this definitely opens your eyes. It's a cut-throat business."

The release of rookie quarterback James MacPherson, meanwhile, left starter Peyton Manning and backup Brock Huard with no third arm to ease their practice workload.

Carrying only two QBs on the roster isn't an outlandish notion for the Colts. They had only two -- Manning and Huard -- over the final eight games of 2002 after they waived Cory Sauter.

The Colts can sign five players to their practice squad today, and MacPherson is a possibility.

Other players waived Sunday included tight end Mike Roberg, wide receiver Adam Herzing, cornerbacks Travis Coleman and Marcus Smith, offensive linemen Joe Iorio, Jim Newton and Patrick Venzke, defensive lineman DeVonte Peterson and fullback Tom Lopienski.

Among interesting tidbits on the 53-player roster:

• Ten rookies survived the cut, four of whom weren't drafted: LB Gary Brackett, WR Aaron Moorehead, S Anthony Floyd and KR Brad Pyatt.

"I thought I had a good camp," said Brackett, who started the final three preseason games while starting middle linebacker Rob Morris recovered from knee surgery. "What I tried to do was go out there and eliminate the mistakes I was making and get better every week."

Moorehead had a team-high two touchdown catches while Pyatt returned a kickoff 95 yards for a touchdown against Cincinnati.

• Besides the 10 rookies, three other players have yet to step on the field for a regular-season game -- offensive lineman Tupe Peko, running back Brian Allen and defensive tackle Brandon Hicks. That translates into 24.5 percent of the roster having no playing time at the NFL level.

• The complications presented by the injuries forced the team to carry only seven offensive linemen.

 

[TheGeneral+]

The Colts trimmed their roster by releasing linebacker Keyon Whiteside, offensive tackle Makeo Freitas, safety David Gibson, defensive end Josh Mallard, tight end Mike Roberg, wide receiver Adam Herzing and kicker Brett Conway.

Other players released were defensive back Travis Coleman, center Joe Iorio, running back Tom Lopienski, quarterback James MacPherson, offensive tackle Jim Newton, defensive tackle DeVonte Peterson, defensive back Marcus Smith and offensive tackle Patrick Venzke.

Indianapolis also traded veteran safety Rich Coady to St. Louis. Coady, who signed with the Colts as a free agent from the Tennessee Titans during the offseason, was traded for an undisclosed draft choice.

 

[TheGeneral+]

The three seasons prior to last season the Indianapolis Colts’ offense was one of the most prolific offenses in the NFL. Last season there was a drop off in production and it wasn’t because Edgerrin James wasn’t 100 percent. For the first time in Peyton Manning’s career he was without the double tight end formation that tormented opposing defenses. With the loss of Ken Dilger, Marcus Pollard wasn’t utilized to his highest potential and the Colts’ offense struggled at times because of that fact.

In the 2003 NFL draft the Colts decided that they needed to replace the void that was left by Dilger and drafted Iowa tight end, Dallas Clark. The drafting of Clark was a surprise to many who expected for the Colts to go defense with their first pick and sneered at selection. However, after this preseason, many fans couldn’t be more thrilled with the selection. Clark who is not the blue-collar blocker that Dilger was but what he does bring to the field is great speed and versatility that allows him to line up in the slot as he did on several occasions this preseason. Most importantly he brings back the double tight end set that the Colts had so much success with in previous seasons.

The person who may benefit the most besides Manning with the addition of Dallas Clark will be Marcus Pollard. Pollard’s production slipped last season, as he was required to stay in more and block. While Pollard is an adequate blocker his role is best served down field catching passes and making big plays. With Clark taking some heat off of Pollard, he should be able to return to the success he enjoyed in 2001 where he averaged over 15 yards per catch and racked up eight touchdowns.


For three seasons now Joe Dean Davenport has served as a reserve tight end with the Colts. He will continue in that role again this season. The Arkansas product was able to haul in eight catches last season as the back up tight end to Marcus Pollard. Davenport also serves on the return unit on special teams.


The fourth tight end on the Colts’ roster isn’t one you will see out catching passes. Justin Snow while listed as tight end serves as the deep snapper for the Colts punting and field goal units. A dependable long snapper, Snow, has been part of one of the most consistent kicking units in the league for the past three seasons. While his value at tight end is nil he is invaluable to the team in clutch kicking situations.


Very few teams carry four tight ends on their roster, but at the same time very few teams are as effective in the double tight end set. Each of the players serve an important role on this team and each should be able to contribute to the Colts success this season.


http://story.theinsiders.com/a.z?s=114&p=2&c=174939

 

[TheGeneral+]

Tony Grossi's scouting report: Indianapolis Colts

09/03/03

What: Browns vs. Indianapolis Colts.

When: 1 p.m. Sunday in Cleveland Browns Stadium.

Colts' 2002 record: 10-7.

Last game: Colts beat Cincinnati, 21-20, in exhibition game on Aug. 29.

Coach: Tony Dungy (second year, 66-53 overall).

Series record: Browns lead, 16-11.

Last meeting: Colts won, 28-23, in Cleveland on Dec. 15. Four second-half touchdowns, two by fill-in runner James Mungro, overturned a 16-0 Browns lead at halftime.

Burning issues: The Colts' first-team defense did not play a single down as a unit in preseason. Middle linebacker Rob Morris is still recovering from surgery in early August and may be unable to play. If so, Gary Brackett, an undrafted rookie free agent from Rutgers, probably would fill in. The starting secondary practiced together for the first time this week.

League rankings: In 2002, Colts offense was 10th (26th rushing, fourth passing), defense was eighth (20th rushing, second passing) and turnover differential was minus-5.

Offensive overview: Their big-play offense still revolves around their Big Three of Peyton Manning, Marvin Harrison and Edgerrin James. But the Colts sought to surround Manning with more options to cut down on his forced interceptions. They used their first draft pick on Dallas Clark to join Marcus Pollard in their favored two tight-end set. Possession receiver Brandon Stokley, a Browns-killer with Baltimore, was acquired to help on third downs. James' return to health should restore the running game. To make sure, coaches created a wall of 330-pound blockers on the right side by moving guard Ryan Diem to tackle and inserting Steve Sciullo, a rookie fourth-round pick, at guard.

Defensive overview: Dungy is trying to re-create the "Cover 2" defense he started with Tampa Bay. The horses aren't the same here. The line is among the league's lightest defensive fronts. Dungy likes it that way, but the lack of bulk makes the Colts easier to run on. Teams strive to get a lead and smash-mouth them into submission in the second half. Like the Browns, the Colts have issues at linebacker and in the secondary. They lost their best linebacker, Mike Peterson, to free agency and their next-best, Rob Morris, didn't play in preseason because of minor knee surgery. Dungy also is breaking in two new starters in the secondary.

Special-teams overview: Kicker Mike Vanderjagt followed the worst season of his career by missing all three field-goal attempts in the preseason. And he failed to improve the length on his shallow kickoffs. Dungy brought in free agent Brett Conway in camp, but he stuck with Vanderjagt. Punter Hunter Smith is solid. The return units were weak last year, but rookie Brad Pyatt returned a kickoff for a touchdown in the last exhibition.

Players to watch: Quarterback Peyton Manning: He operated on the Browns' defense like a surgeon in leading the Colts to four touchdowns after a bad first half in December. Calling and changing plays at the line of scrimmage, he threw for 212 yards and two touchdowns in the second half.

Receiver Marvin Harrison: Kevin Johnson considers him the league's best receiver. He looked like it with 118 yards and two touchdowns in one half against the Browns. Dungy said Harrison can exceed his NFL-record 143 catches in a season. Dungy said 10 a game is possible.

Running back Edgerrin James: Now 22 months removed from major knee surgery, he expects to return to previous form when he averaged 1,630 yards and 13 touchdowns in 1999 and 2000.

Right defensive end Dwight Freeney: After netting 13 sacks in 12 games as a rookie, the speed rusher draws his first assignment of his second season against Barry Stokes. He had two sacks and nine tackles with Ross Verba playing left tackle last year.

Injury report: DB Donald Strickland (groin) and DB Cliff Crosby (groin) have not practiced; WR Brandon Stokley (hamstring) played sparingly in preseason; MLB Rob Morris (knee) did not play in a preseason game.

Small world: Colts tackle Tarik Glenn was born in Cleveland. . . . Colts rookie safety Mike Doss is from Canton and played at McKinley High School and Ohio State. . . . Colts offensive line coach Howard Mudd was the same for the Browns from 1983 to '88. . . . Dom Anile, Colts director of football operations, was a Browns "super scout" from 1983 to '93. . . . Colts defensive line coach John Teerlinck was the same with Browns in 1989-90 . . . . Browns offensive coordinator Bruce Arians was Colts quarterback coach from 1998 to 2000. . . . Browns quarterback Kelly Holcomb played with the Colts from 1996 to 2000. . . . Browns running back Jamel White was in the Colts training camp in 2000. . . . Todd Stewart, Browns media relations director, worked for the Colts from 1990 to '98.

http://www.cleveland.com/sports/plaindealer/index.ssf?/base/sports/1062586501207530.xml

 

[TheGeneral+]

Atleast Manning drove em' to the 1 yd line before throwing INT #1

 

[TheGeneral+]

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by The General:
Manning & Vandy have made up. Upon reporting to camp, Vandy was wearing a Manning jersey. Both parties would not discuss & said it had been worked out. It was to be kept in the family they said.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Cleveland

D played very well. Vandy wins game. 9-6

Colts 1-0

 

[TheGeneral+]

CLEVELAND -- With the sell-out crowd of 73,358 on its feet and Cleveland Browns Stadium in full roar today, calm reigned.

It reigned in the huddle, where quarterback Peyton Manning and the Indianapolis Colts' offense shrugged off a mistake-riddled day and executed when it mattered. It reigned in placekicker Mike Vanderjagt, who inhaled all the clamor and confusion, smirked, then lofted the game-winning 45-yard field goal that stilled it.

Oooooooomph.

"I was sitting next to (rookie center) Jeff Faine at the end, and I told him to get used to it," said Browns right tackle Ryan Tucker. "You play your tail off the whole game, and it comes down to a field goal."

The seventh game-winning kick of Vanderjagt's career was a bit of a knuckleball, low but lethal, clearing the crossbar with the clock reading 0:01. It gave the Colts a 9-6 victory.

"They stand there and they yell and scream at you. They did it at Buffalo. They did it at Miami in '99 and at Denver last year," said Vanderjagt, ticking off some of his previous gamewinners as he slipped the game ball into a backpack in front of his locker. "I don't know when they're going to realize they should really be quiet and not mess with me.

"Game tied, six seconds left, that's exactly where I want to be."

The same mentality pervaded the Colts' huddle during the 11-play, 60-yard drive over the final 2 1/2 minutes that carried the winners from their own 8-yard line to the Browns' 27 to set up the winning kick.

"No penalties, no mistakes, get out of bounds, play smart and let's make some plays," Manning told the Colts huddled around him. "This is why you play: a two-minute drive on opening day."

Vanderjagt's sixth gamewinner on the road was his second at Cleveland. He kicked a 21-yarder to beat the Browns 29-28 in 1999. Four seconds remained that day.

The victory was the Colts' fifth consecutive on opening day. With Miami's 21-20 loss to Houston, that's the longest such streak in the NFL.

Vanderjagt and the offense can thank the defense. It carried the load on a sparkling day on the shore of Lake Erie. The Colts hadn't won a game without scoring a touchdown since 1993. Despite giving up a lot of mileage between the 20s, the Colts kept an explosive Browns offense out of the end zone.

"I think it shows something about our character," said cornerback Nick Harper, who intercepted two Kelly Holcomb passes, broke up four others and made six tackles. "They drove the ball, but when it came down to the nitty gritty, we held them."

Holcomb hit 20-of-29 passes for 182 yards. After Harper's two interceptions, he seldom threw downfield.

The Colts denied the Browns three times on first-and-goal from the 1 late in the first quarter, with outside linebacker Marcus Washington involved in each play. Cleveland gained 1 yard in three attempts after driving to first-and-goal at the 3 during the third quarter.

Both times, Phil Dawson kicked field goals.

Vanderjagt spent a troubled offseason after criticizing Manning and head coach Tony Dungy for lacking emotion. Vanderjagt was forced to compete for his job during the preseason, when he went 0-for-3.

But with Manning throwing a pair of interceptions and the Colts resorting to the running game only 15 times for 67 yards, Vanderjagt was perfect in three attempts. He converted from 22 and 46 yards and the game was a 6-6 tie when the Colts got the ball back at their own 8 with 2:39 to play.

Manning completed 8-of-10 passes for all 65 yards on the winning drive. The biggest was a 15-yarder to wide receiver Reggie Wayne on third-and-10 from the Colts' 34 with 1:29 to play. With wide receiver Marvin Harrison double-covered on the right side, Wayne got open over the middle, and Manning was looking for him.

"That's one of those things I live for, especially trying to make something happen on third and long," said Wayne. "It was just my number today."

Dungy and Manning were less subdued.

"Huge," said Dungy.

"The biggest play of the game, other than the kick," said Manning, who completed 27-of-43 passes for 211 yards and had what easily might have been a third interception dropped by cornerback Daylon McCutcheon.

It was a ragged performance by both teams.

The Colts had nine penalties for 53 yards, the Browns nine for 64 yards. Both teams fumbled twice. The Browns converted 4-of-11 third downs. The Colts ran seven plays inside the Cleveland 10-yard line; they gained six yards.

"I'm disappointed and a little bit angry," said Cleveland coach Butch Davis.

"I'm baffled as to the penalties, errors and mistakes," said Dungy.

At least Dungy could grin. Baffled is better than beaten.

http://www.indystar.com/print/articles/1/072201-2021-094.html

 

[TheGeneral+]

RUSHING OFFENSE

First, a note: This year's Dopey Report Card will not be offering the pass/fail option. Now, the run offense. What run offense? It's not that the Colts didn't run it effectively. The Colts just didn't run it, even by the goal line. Usually, a 3-to-1 pass-to-run ratio comes when you're playing catch-up. They said they would commit to run with a healthy Edgerrin James back. Well, start committing.

C

PASSING OFFENSE

Yes, the final drive had its classic moments, especially when Peyton Manning hit Reggie Wayne. But the quarterback looked skittish all day, didn't he? It's not often, either, that Marvin Harrison averages 4.9 yards a reception. When did he become a possession receiver? (Just kidding, Marvin.) There's too much talent for this kind of offensive performance, especially against a rebuilt defense.

B+

RUN DEFENSE

They gave up yards, but everybody gives up yards. They didn't give up TDs. Tony Dungy hates the bend-but-don't-break stuff, but that's become this group's hallmark. We keep hearing about the smallish Colts defense, but they looked pretty big on two goal-line stands.

A-

PASS DEFENSE

OK, yards. But that's it. What? You want the '85 Bears? A very good Browns offense never got into the end zone. You come in here and shut out the locals, you've done a job -- although you could live without the roughing-the-passer penalties. And if Nick Harper isn't somebody's defensive player of the week, the voting is rigged.

B

SPECIAL TEAMS

A game-winning kick. Enough said. The return game was solid, notably Brad Pyatt and his game-opening kick return. Note to Hunter Smith: Keep doing that drop-kick thing.

B

INTANGIBLES

After four years of doing the DRC, I still have no idea what intangibles are. But if you win at Cleveland, it's likely the intangibles had a pretty good day. Especially the defensive intangibles, who bailed out the offensive intangible with a tangibly marvelous effort.

B

COACHING

Forget Tony Dungy. My question is, "What is Tom Moore trying to do on offense?" The guy is a coaching legend, but this team has no identity. Both offensive coordinators, it seemed, were guilty of impatience. As for what Moore and Bruce Arians were trying to do in the red zone, my guess is as good as yours.