ok lets say there is no 'higher power' of any kind....
Then what is the purpose of being good, or doing the right thing? If there is no consequence (other than punishment from your fellow man) then why be good? if we are created from evolution, its survival of the fittest right? So we prey on the weak and look out for number 1
Generally speaking, we seem to have a conscience when it comes to certain situations, moral and unmoral. A general sense of whats right and whats wrong.... or is it just me?
Then what is the purpose of being good, or doing the right thing? If there is no consequence (other than punishment from your fellow man) then why be good? if we are created from evolution, its survival of the fittest right? So we prey on the weak and look out for number 1
Generally speaking, we seem to have a conscience when it comes to certain situations, moral and unmoral. A general sense of whats right and whats wrong.... or is it just me?
Except for the little fact that we are social animals, we dont live alone, we act together, we are social animals. As a society we stand a better chance of surviving if we dont kill each other over whats the "real" imaginary being. As a group, the more and smarter people we have...the better a chance to survive.
Those 'certain situations' you describe are totally relative. what exactly are these "conscience" of "moral and unmoral" you mention, if we analyze them they could be totally relative from a cultural perspective.
I dont know if my dogs believe in a "god" but they are sleeping in peace and not trying to kill each other, is this a proof of god(s)? I dont think so. Now if they were reptiles....they may not be so peaceful. Reptiles are not social animals.
This obsession of having a purpose in life and needing a justification for 'being good' is what makes me think sometimes that religion may be a necessary evil, former poster Darryl Parsons explained it very well once
Now the problem I have is that, unfortunately religions all over have failed at the "being good" and having a "conscience" part. Look at the world today, most people believe in one religion or the other and what do we have to show for that? Never ending wars, genocide, famine, treating ourselves worse than animals, etc etc etc.
You could say "they are not really following the blabla", I will say "the blabla is most decidedly ineffective at producing a better society, fear mongering based on a higher being(s) is NOT working! and the problem can only get worse as there is more people on the planet"
Evolution (here I go again) tells us that our most primitive instincts are those or reptiles, perhaps we are simply doomed to never be able to live in peace due to that.
You can't believe that someone who is gay believes they are in the wrong? You don't know many gay people then. Those people don't believe they are being good by being gay. Others refuse to believe that they are "bad" and therefore don't believe in an afterlife because if they were to believe then they would have to suffer for it.
There are many people who believe this way.
To each is own in my opinion. Just don't try to ram it down my throat. I had to attend church every Sunday as a kid and I used to joke to my parents on how towards the end of mass we would be shaking everybody's hand in church and moments later as we got in our cars to leave the parking lot it was a mad dash to exit and the same people shaking your hand were cutting you off to get the hell out of there.. Unbelievable but true.
To me organized religion is a scam. It's all about getting people to contribute more and more money to keep the church going.. The Catholic Church is the richest private organization in the world. But come every year they are having the Archdiocese drive to keep the Churches head above water. That's on top of all there weekly and second collections that they don't count.
On a side note , maybe I missed it but at this years NFL draft , I don't believe I heard one player who was interviewed, Thank God . In years past it was a regular GOD fest. I wonder if this was on purpose as they were being coached not to say it, or all these kids are starting to believe that God has nothing to do with it...
To me organized religion is a scam. It's all about getting people to contribute more and more money to keep the church going.. The Catholic Church is the richest private organization in the world. But come every year they are having the Archdiocese drive to keep the Churches head above water. That's on top of all there weekly and second collections that they don't count.
On a side note , maybe I missed it but at this years NFL draft , I don't believe I heard one player who was interviewed, Thank God . In years past it was a regular GOD fest. I wonder if this was on purpose as they were being coached not to say it, or all these kids are starting to believe that God has nothing to do with it...
Whether we like it or not, the Zeitgeist is changing in the Western world, particularly among the youth. The idea of an all-powerful god is a fading concept as scientific evidence mounts and people expand their knowledge through the Internet.
Sorry if this sounds like a knock on religion and belief, but I'm simply stating the facts (e.g. http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs...s-come-online/2012/03/22/gIQArGw0TS_blog.html).
There are three seminal books that are contributing to this change: The God Delusion by Richard Dawkins, The End of Faith by Sam Harris and God Is Not Great by Chistopher Hitchens.
If you are a true believer and you are willing to challenge your faith, try reading one, if not all three, of these books. That said, I should warn you that if you do read these books, you may rock your belief system to the core.
Sorry if this sounds like a knock on religion and belief, but I'm simply stating the facts (e.g. http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs...s-come-online/2012/03/22/gIQArGw0TS_blog.html).
There are three seminal books that are contributing to this change: The God Delusion by Richard Dawkins, The End of Faith by Sam Harris and God Is Not Great by Chistopher Hitchens.
If you are a true believer and you are willing to challenge your faith, try reading one, if not all three, of these books. That said, I should warn you that if you do read these books, you may rock your belief system to the core.
I've read all three, and watched many debates by these guys. Dawkins is an embarrassment to atheists, and many say so. Watch some debates between Sam Harris and William Lane Craig. Christopher Hitchens was so convincing, his own brother Peter wrote a book how his brother's atheism led him to Christianity:
We have to take into account at some point, long ago, there were no rules, no laws, no morals, and so on.
The world was a free for all and out of control.
Could it be that a few very wise men decided that mankind needed some type of order, and took into account that the only way people would listen and obey any such rules, is to put a scare in them, hence the reason for and the creation of the bible....?
I truly hope for all of our sake that every theory we have discounting the possibility of a higher existence, is wrong.
If there is nothing more, then life is just a tease and a cruel joke..... Pointless
Bingo. From an atheist point of view, life is meaningless:
"Humans have always wondered about the meaning of life...
life has no higher purpose than to perpetuate the survival of DNA...
life has no design, no purpose, no evil and no good, nothing but
blind pitiless indifference."
[FONT=Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif][SIZE=-1]-- Richard Dawkins, River Out of Eden: A Darwinian View of Life (1995), quoted from Victor J Stenger, Has Science Found God? (2001)[/SIZE][/FONT]
Right, but if it was indeed created by man for the sole purpose of bringing some type of control to the world and to mankind, then someone initially came up with the idea and it has to be one of, if not the most brilliant idea ever...
If...... That is..... I'm still stuck in the middle
Depends on how many is many, I know at least ten (which I am sure, its not many), none feel that way, perhaps its because they are younger than the ones you know (?) and therefore were not subject as intensely to the "you are going to hell for doing this" part.
Then again what % of people is atheist AND gay AND believe there is no god for the reason you state?
I suppose a similar case could be made for people who commited murder or a major crime, are in jail and would claim to not believe in god because its easier for them when they die, IIRC the % of atheists in jail is MINUSCULE.
