Cool guys. Like I said I may have over-generalized the viewpoints. I was going off memory.
At the time of the invasion of Afg. I was posting at Major Wager and the entire forum was a war zone.
There were many posters, mostly far-left Euros who read the Independent and the al-Guardian who thought the US brought 9/11 on ourselves, and claimed a distinction between the Taliban and the terrorist group al-Queda that they harbored.
Their arguments included the same points as Iraq, such as --You can't invade a "sovereign nation" because a "militant" group operates there; it's not a war but a "police action," etc.
I consider both you Judge and you ST as Liberals. And I have no bias at all against the term Liberal whatsoever. Many of my own views are Liberal. I don't consider you guys to be fringe leftys. However, your point is taken.
As far as ktv goes, I was asking him to accept something I stated from memory, but that failed to meet the rigorous standards he sets for what is acceptable as intelligent debate on this forum.
And since this is a room occupied every minute with intelligent discourse in which one extreme has 'proven' every breath we take in life is controlled by a nefarious entity called "them," while their polar opposites have "intelligently" demonstrated we had dinosaurs as pets 6,000 years ago, and that two guys blowing each other 6 miles down the road is somehow going to make their own dick and brain simultaneously explode......well, sadly I failed to meet those rigorous standards.