An on-line casino is stiffing me

HantaVirus · Jul 8, 2003

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Slash:

Filing a complaint at the meister or with Julie won't do you any good at all: The casino was upfront with their requirements so you have no case at all.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

I agree Slash, Mr. Smith "screwed the pooch", but I thought I would at least try and provide him some useful information.

Mr.Smith · Jul 8, 2003

Yes, some people are missing the truly crazy aspect of this.

Blackjack, craps, video poker, roulette and bacarette are excluded games.

Any play on any of those games counts nothing towards bonus requirements.

I could play roulette for a month betting $5 a spin on black. If I turned the initial $200 into $950 they would not pay. "Its against our rules".

I don't know if anyone can help me. It is in the rules. My points are;

1. Their rules are insane, I mean way over the top crazy. A LOT of innocent gamblers will be stolen from if this madness is enforced. A rollover requirement is fine, not allowing EVER a withdrawal unless you play 20x on a non-banned game is bizarre.
( Imagine going to the Bellagio and winning $280 at blackjack and getting " Sir, we can't pay you, it's against our rules, until you play 6 hours on a quarter slot machine")
2. I don't want any bonus.
3. A fair solution seems to be the revoking of the bonus and payment of legitimate winnings. I don't see why this is a problem.

DavidMatthews · Jul 8, 2003

Ooops... I missed the part about BJ being a banned game. Most places don't exclude blackjack so I was surprised.

I like the video poker solution.

Play something that is not excluded, you're almost definitely coming out better than if you forfeit your bonus and winnings.

David

Mr.Smith · Jul 8, 2003

Slash,
Their software automatically credited the bonus, I never asked for it and I don't want it. I am not trying to abuse a bones. I renounce any claim to the bonus. I cannot see why it would be anything less than fair for them to revoke the bonus and pay the rest.

HacheMan · Jul 8, 2003

I have never, ever seen an online casino's bonus rules exclude the main game, blackjack. Roulette yes, but nothing else.

Mr.Smith · Jul 8, 2003

david,

video poker also excluded. I like video poker its fun.

they do have Pai gao poker. which I play a little in Las Vegas, well that is have played a very little. I like the game, but know little about it. I have a few gambling books around, maybe I can bone up on it and run the requirment through that way.

I would feel very ripped off if I have to play a lot of pai gow poker to qualify for a bonus I neither asked for nor want to claim.

is it really that hard to pay $280 to a drunken blackjack winner? THAT CASINO IS PATHETIC!!!!

HantaVirus · Jul 8, 2003

Okay, I will try and make one last case for you and you can try this out on the casino.
1. Is this bonus the 1st deposit 100% match bonus? If the answer is yes then per the casino terms:This offer is not valid if bets are placed in the games of Roulette, Blackjack, Blackjack Switch, Baccarat or Craps.
If you withdraw before having reached the minimum wagering requirements, your bonus and winnings will be void.

So, if the only game you played was blackjack ( or any other restricted game) you should not have been eligible for the bonus. Also, if you did place bets on non-restricted games did those bets exceed $600 since you have to wager the deposit 6 times before receiving the $100 bonus?

Come on use your brain and determine if they complied with the exact wording in the terms and conditions.

If you only bet blackjack then you should never have been eligible for the bonus in the first place, if you bet $600 on non-restricted games you have to meet the $1200 wagering requirement. Where did they get this 20 times deposit and bonus ($2000)?

READ THE RULES

HantaVirus · Jul 8, 2003

Is the website the correct one listed above, This sites terms says you only get the bonus after wagering the deposit 6 times. Make sure that they are playing by their own terms and conditions on the site.

HantaVirus · Jul 8, 2003

You know I think this is a bait and switch job.

See terms and conditions here
http://www.casino-club-dice.com/promotions.html?1#13

vs.

this one http://www.clubdicecasino.com/

Looks like the same casino to me with different playthrough requirements.

Tell them you thought the requirements were from the first link.

Mr.Smith · Jul 8, 2003

hantavirus,

the way it works( And part of my gripe) is that upon setting up a new account and depositing $100, you are automatically instantly credited an additional $100.

So I never asked for the bonus or had to wager a minimum amount to get it. it was placed in my account.

according to their terms, I must wager 40x $200 on a non-restricted game before any winnings can be cashed out.

My beef is that such a rule is so blatently unfair that it is a license to steal from just about every winner in the damn place.

Imagine you posted up with a sportsbook and after a month of betting you wanted to withdraw. They said no and pointed out a rule buried in their terms and conditions that sportsbook players must gamble an equal amount of their sportsbook wagers on slots in our casino before any withdrawals. people on this board would go ape shit against the book.

I played BJ for 5 hours or so. I don't qualify for any bonus under their rules and I'm OK with that. My balance is $477 deduct $100 bonus and pay me $377.

BEANTOWNJIM · Jul 8, 2003

BUTTERNUTS DID I HEAR YOU SAY YOU SHOULD HAVE READ THE RULES WELL OFFSHORE THE RULES DONT MATTER JUST ASK LENNY AND CASCADE

THEY WRITE RULES BUT DONT FOLLOW THEM SO F-CK THE RULE BOOK THESE CROOKS WILL DO WHAT THEY WANT

ALWAYS TAKE A HIT ON 12 IN BLACKJACK NO MATTER WHAT THE DEALER IS SHOWING

I GRIN WHEN I WIN

Halifax · Jul 8, 2003

"By getting a bonus and starting with $200 instead of $100 does that give me any advantage over the house that they need to protect themselves from? "
---------------------------

Mr. Smith:

Of course you have a decided advantage, and unfortunately, you do not have a case (based on their rules).

You have two choices:

1. Play the required 20X.
2. Cash out only your initial deposit.

These casinos do not allow you to cash out winnings before the rollover requirements are met. A FEW sportsbooks still allow you to cash out winnings before rollover requirements are met, but unfortunately, I think that within the next year, this will be a thing of the past at the few sportsbooks that still allow this.

[This message was edited by Halifax on July 08, 2003 at 11:58 PM.]

Mr.Smith · Jul 8, 2003

Halifax,
remember, I don't want to cash out the bonus, so I am not getting it. Its there in my account but I want them to remove it. Had I deposited $100 gotton the bonus, lost $100 and then tried to cash out the other $100, then yes, thats clearly abusive.

I played a lot of blackjack and I don't want the bonus. My question was, by starting with this extra boost and then not claiming it later, is their some edge? I do not believe there is and thus, I think I have a case.

Mr.Smith · Jul 8, 2003

by the way, I was not trying to skirt the rules for some sort of bonus abuse idea. if I had been sober and read their rules, I would never have played there.

I suspect I'll have to play some crappy game to be able to cash out, but what a stiff casino these people are running. their " rules" are a license to steal. restrictions to the point they are enforcing are crazy and UNNECCESSARY! I don't want to claim a bonus.It is just plain theft of winnings.

Mr.Smith · Jul 8, 2003

hantavirus,
thanks, very interesting sleuthing you did. that is clearly the same casino, with a slightly differnet address and VERY different bonus requirements. I have e-mailed them a complaint about not honoring their own policy. its guaranteed not to work. these people are out to stiff me. I guess they don't like people who show up one night, win and try to cash out.

what gall I had! I thought it was OK to gamble and if you win, collect.

TheGeneral+ · Jul 8, 2003

Mr. Smith, after reading this thread and the website, I do not condone their actions, but see no case for reimbursement.

Get your dollar and bail.

Good wishes

areeff · Jul 8, 2003

Most of them are thieves that will find any small term or condition to F you.

adp1000 · Jul 8, 2003

It doesn't appear that you were trying to "abuse" their bonus, however you did not play by their rules, hence should not be able to cash out your winnings. if I were you I would go and play the required amount on the correct games. They need these rules for a reason. Player could easily win with the the bonus if allowed to withdraw winnings from BJ forfeiting the bonus.

Mr.Smith · Jul 8, 2003

their rules are a license to steal and are so unfair, they don't apply.

the losers lose, the winners, most of them get stiffed due to the rules buried in the fine print. imagine you ran the casino, your losers lose, most of your winners don't qualify for a cashout unless they forfeit all their winnings. thats not running a casino, its stealing.

it should work like the sportsbooks do it, if you don't bet enough to qualify for a bonus, you can cash out but they revoke the bonus. you can win or lose under those terms, but its fair to everyone. insisting no cash outs until you play $4000 in slots is nuts.

if on-line gambling is going to work, its a two way street. both sides have rules which allow a fair chance of winning. when it gets lopsided like this, something has to be done.

GringoinCR · Jul 8, 2003

This is pretty cut and dry. Their rules are crazy and no one in their right mind would play there. In fact no one in their right mind should be playing at online casinos. The only exception to that rule would be if the casino is linked to a good sports book and even then use discretion.

Once you send money you have to play by their rules. You have, whether you know it or not, agreed to their terms at that point.

I would say get whatever you can back and chalk it up to a learning experience.