My take on the bad line rule

[DickyW]

"I shop for off lines not bad lines. Very big difference"

What is the difference big guy, and explain it to me like I'm a 2yr old

Quote from Owen

"College game.
game total was 125
1st half total was 68.5.
As some of you know unlike nba, in college the 1st half total doesnt always have to be half the game total"

LMFAO was this line "off" or "bad"?

Mr Owen
What would you have made the halftime line in that game? I might be a moron but since halftime totals are slightly less then half the game total my number would have been NO MORE then 62.

So is 6 points in a college HALFTIME total be a <bad line> or <off line>?

 

[Owen]

Dicky I aint in the business of makin numbers Im in the business of betting them. You make em I bet em. Books like you that whine and bit*h like to put all its responsibility on the player. Books like cascade who eat their mistakes and book all that they bet are considered "real bookmakers" imho.

 

[DickyW]

I understand your point and can respect it. It's a tough call where the line should be drawn. I think we all know what a bad line is before we bet it. I would NEVER bet a total that was 10 pts off IMO that is just as bad as grabbing the Dolphins +3 instead on -3. I am not going to ruin my relationship with a good book by stealing. Once again the player has a obligation to be honest and fair just as the book does.

 

[paulajackson]

According to Dave's explanation of the bad line rule and the criteria used to determine whether or not a bet should stand implies the following:

Had the bet lost the five players that got paid would have lost the 2 players that were treated too harshly and reconsidered by Dave would have lost only the amount of their average wager and the two same state bets should have been refunded in full but out of fairness Dave would have kept half of that money anyway. Since the investigation began before the event started application of the criteria should have resulted in the above resolution had the bets lost. Casablanca is simply playing results here and past-posting these players. None of us ever would have heard of this had the bets lost.

 

[DickyW]

Owen
Gotta respect you, your not only a thief but an arrogant one at that. Your such an evasive scumbag your trying to turn our pissing match into Owen (the player) VS Dicky (the Bookmaker) it's not about that dumbass. Your dishonest, I'm not! I call a book when a line is bad, you play it. When a total is off 18 points I pass, you play it, and stroke yourself thinking you found value. Bottom line your a shoplifter stealing from the stores I like to shop at.

Quit making references like your a "sharp" player. You could'nt make a nunmber if your life depended on it your a disgrace and should be banned from playing online

 

[Owen]

Your right -3 vs +3 is also obvious but -2 vs 1.5 is gray ..Dicky I'll admit that I can never do what you guys do. To me its the hardest job in the world bookmakin and thats why I choose to be on this side of the counter.

I just feel it aint right to give a shop full control to cancel a contract (readback) on ambiguous and subjective phrases like "obvious error". I try to be as fair as possible. Contrary to popular belief Im not as bad as people say I am. Im not Mr Bad Line. I bet 10's of thousands of dollars a day and none of them are bets on bad lines.

 

[skirmish]

I know Owen and he ain't no thief he just shops around , scalps and bets just makin a livin that's the game .
He is a stand up guy and has always paid on time every time , not like alot of the MOFOs out there .

 

[huckleberry]

OWEN

you are a douche-bag bad line playing m@ther f#cker -- you are a well known scam artist you piece of sh!t

that is your specialty and many shops know exactly who you are -- so give it a rest jackass

 

[raiders72001]

I remember Owen. He once bet under 68.5 on a hlftime line when the line should have been 58.5. He then <claimed> to have been trying to middle because his <local> had 66.

 

[Sodium Pentethol V]

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR> Ive run into shops cryin bad line to me all the time <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

That's because your a scumbag crook that sits on his fat ass all day and night doing nothing but scouting out bad lines,

who give a flying f what you have to say about it, guys like you are the reason the phrase bad line even exists.

 

[paulajackson]

How can we be 100% sure a place is posting a bad line and not shading it with an opinion to draw money on a particular side. Keep in mind Casa clearly put an opinion into their opening number. How can we be sure they didn't move it to plus 605 because they wanted to have a big position on a big favorite that they were sure was gonna win. Casablanca is the one that took the shot.

 

[Owen]

huckleberry and sodium your kind words are much appreciated. I actually lost about a second of sleep thinking about your words.

Skirmish .. I dont know exactly who you are but I appreciate you telling the truth.

My opinion on bad lines will never change. A bad line needs to be explicitly defined or a shop should book all its bets taken on the phone (computer wouldn't be fair as glitches can occur). Anything less would be lack of responsibility. Unfortunately 99% of the shops out there do lack responsibility.

 

[Maniac]

Having an opinion is one thing - but 18 points different is definately not an opinion.

 

[cecil+]

I agree completely with Owen.
As long as players put up with the books deciding when you win or lose instead of the outcome of your bets nothing will change...

 

[SENDITIN]

Owen,

Why don't you use this as a general rule on bad lines....If you were the bookie would you hold the bet at the line you are trying to play? If you have the slightest inkling that you wouldn't, don't play it.

You and Areeff would have a lot more credibility if you said that you subscribe to the "You book it..you pay it" mentality and you took a shot on a bad line...tough luck bookie. I can respect that at least you're being honest. But to come into the forums and try to justify the lines you guys take a shot at is comical. And to try and say PRO FIVE was the ONLY one who had a line up on a particular game is even more comical. The only way that would happen is if they had the wrong date or it was past posted. Since when did PRO FIVE become the first one up with lines?

 

[JoeyC]

Common Sense is the rule to apply here.

IF a number is off say -3 to -4 or even -4 1/2 the store should honor it, without any question, end of story.

IF a number is way off line a -4 is a +4 that's an honest mistake, or a -4 is posted at -24, well that's just a blatant error.

Money line bets should be paid to within 20% or so, IN FULL PERIOD.

IF a shop is sloppy with bad lines, on a semi regular basis, the SHOP SHOULD BE AVOIDED, obviously they aren't very professional and other problems will surely come up.

 

[Owen]

Joey I appreciate your input....

However, common sense is once again a subjective solution and will thus result in conflict. You said 3 vs 4.5. how bout 3 vs 5. Or in wnba 131 vs 135. I see discrepencies like these more often then people think cuz I'm into middling these games. I've had reputable shops cry bad line to me when they had 9.5u and a handful of shops had 9 flat. Its disgusting how much this rule is abused and an objective solution needs to be put in place or the book should honor what it books.

SENDIT....
If I ran a shop I would book EVERYTHING THAT my clerks gave readbacks for cuz readbacks are final. However I would employ safe guard tactics like several reputable shops like cascade does today. Any bet over 1k needs to be yelled up to the stage. If your a bookmaker and you accept a bet placed on the phone and you make your clerks yell big bets up to the stage you would never fu*k up. And if you did then you should eat your mistake because a readback is a contract entered by 2 parties that a bet has taken place. A violation of this contract shows a complete lack of responsibility.

 

[SENDITIN]

Owen,

How about the guys who get the bet over the internet? Let's say 50 guys slap you two minutes before game time on a bad line. No way to pull it down before post time. I understand where you are coming from, but I think you're trying to create a perfect gambling world...and it isn't. You can't compare large shops with small shops either. That's like comparing WalMart to Joe's Discount shoes. Walmart will honor a mismarked price because they're big enough(and they don't do it that often because they can hire enough people to help avoid the situation.) But it can kill local Joe if people take advantage of him. He doesn't have the resources to make things near perfect. Does that mean he shouldn't be in business?

 

[dimeplayersonly]

as someone who has posted "upside down" lines before....i dont even give it a second thought on whether a bet on a "bad line" should stand.........YES IT SHOULD

its the books responsibilty to make sure all lines are accurate, obviously mistakes can and will happen..


but guess what??? as a book, thats part of the job....

IMO, a book is much better off by not even making an issue of "bad lines" ...grade the tickets on go on....it saves time, aggravation, getting your reputation rung through the ringer...ect

obviously, for a book to make an issue out of a situation like this, it must have been a good chunk of money..

if that is the case, then that tells me that someone is not taking care of business..

maybe they should stick to dealing foots, bases, and baskets only.........

 

[dimeplayersonly]

SENDITTIN............you make a valid point about wagers over the internet...

but still, the book should have safeguards ....mainly betting limits, and type of action taken....otherwise your leaving yourself open for shot-takers...

books should understand that internet betting is where your going to have the majority of problems...

if your letting guys bet dimes on obscure prop bets over the internet, you should expect to have problems ...