My 2015 offseason thread

[DropDimes]

I'm gonna take your comments w/ a grain of salt, as you're a fan.

I'm a Gator fan and I can show you posts where there were idiots trying to convince themselves that all Muschamp needed was one more year and he'd turn the corner. It is what it is. Nebraska hired an slightly above average coach who is well past his prime in the hopes he catches lighting in a bottle. The hire makes no sense, no matter how much you want it to. I actually like the guy and hope he does well. College football is better when the Nebraska's of the CFB world are good.

Would love to hear why it makes no sense other than you saying "it makes no sense". Yes, I am a Nebraska fan but that doesn't mean I can't be level headed. Do I think it was a home run hire and the best guy we could get? No, definitely not. But did his hire make sense, absolutely it did. Yourself and others who say it makes no sense are looking it from the other perspective of is it the best we could have done, and confusing the two. To say it makes no sense without having an in-depth knowledge of Nebraska football and its history is simply arrogant. You have to understand the culture and what the program means to its fans to understand that this hire does make sense. It may sound dumb to other fan bases across the country, but Riley's demeanor and personality are hue factors in this. Here are some of the top qualities Nebraska looks for in a coach, you tell me if Riley fits:

Ties to the prigram
someone willing to allow the fans into the program
someone willing to respect the traditions in place
someome who will bring in top
a great evaluator of talent
a great developer of players
Ability to produce winning teams and compete with the best teams we play
someonw who represents the university in a respectful manor
someone who respects and values in-state players and the walk on program

You tell me, where does Riley fall short? Are there bigger names we could've gotten, sure, but more than likely not the elite coaches. Do I think Riley is going to come in and put us in the top 15 next year, no, I dont. But is he restoring the program to were it used to be before the Pelini regime, absolutely.

 

[russ1945]

DropDimes: way to early to tell where the program is going to go under Riley. Trouble is when a program reaches the top and can't stay. It was not that long ago that I took all kind of flack saying Tebow would not win the Heisman in his final season and that the Florida program was not going to be able to maintain it's position at the top of the heap. I was ridiculed for making those statements which were made way in advance of things going south for Tebow and the Gators. Is Riley the answer, I don't think so but we shall see. I think like Texas they settled for a new HC. All of the qualities that you are looking for are rare and hard to perpetuate. Those schools who do find someone who fits that bill do succeed. We shall see. BOL

 

[CoachCB]

DropDimes: way to early to tell where the program is going to go under Riley. Trouble is when a program reaches the top and can't stay. It was not that long ago that I took all kind of flack saying Tebow would not win the Heisman in his final season and that the Florida program was not going to be able to maintain it's position at the top of the heap. I was ridiculed for making those statements which were made way in advance of things going south for Tebow and the Gators. Is Riley the answer, I don't think so but we shall see. I think like Texas they settled for a new HC. All of the qualities that you are looking for are rare and hard to perpetuate. Those schools who do find someone who fits that bill do succeed. We shall see. BOL

Russ, Tebow's last UF team went 13-1. Not sure how things went south "for Tebow and the Gators". Maybe just "the Gators"....because Tebow went out a winner. But to your point, yes...it is difficult to stay on top for a long period of time. For Saban and Bama, if they don't win the National Championship critics start saying "they're done!" It's ridiculous.

 

[russ1945]

Russ, Tebow's last UF team went 13-1. Not sure how things went south "for Tebow and the Gators". Maybe just "the Gators"....because Tebow went out a winner. But to your point, yes...it is difficult to stay on top for a long period of time. For Saban and Bama, if they don't win the National Championship critics start saying "they're done!" It's ridiculous.

I was just referring to him not winning the Heisman that year.

 

[russ1945]

Golden Nugget’s GOY lines are out. If you will go to philsteele.com they have a blog out today covering last year’s opening and closing lines for the GOY’s. Very interesting read.

For instance, TCU came out -10 against SMU and it closed during the regular season at -31. Oklahoma came out at -11 against Okie St and it closed at OU -21 and they lost to OSU. It appears that all the lines moved except 7 of them. You should check it out. This also reflects on preseason expectations among other things.

 

[CoachCB]

It makes no sense?? Well, here goes:

-He was/is a mediocre/slightly above average coach (93-80 record, no PAC12 championships...or divisional championships). Add in his 13-34 NFL record and 40-32 CFL record and he has a career losing record as a head coach.

-He's old (for a new football coach), will be 62 in a week.

-No ties whatsoever to Nebraska....and barely any ties to the midwest, much less the Big 10 - which is a potential recruiting problem.

-In 14 seasons at Oregon State he won 10 games ONCE! ONE TIME!

-He's essentially a west coast coach; again, this is going to have implications on the recruiting trail.

-He's known as a "nice guy" (give me Saban, Spurrier, Urban Meyer, Harbaugh, Les Miles any day over a "nice guy" coach).

-Sub .500 conference record

-6 of his Oregon State teams didn't make a bowl game (in 14 seasons), almost half of his tenure...missing a bowl in 3 of his last 5 years.

-Oregon State fans are happy to see him leave (should tell you something)


Here's a few good article on hiring mediocrity (as I'm not the only one who thinks so...and I could post about 20 more of these same articles):

http://thelantern.com/2014/12/opini...y-shows-nebraskas-priorities-are-out-of-line/

http://www.pennlive.com/sports/index.ssf/2014/12/nebraskas_stunning_hire_of_ore.html

http://www.knowitallfootball.com/2014/12/05/nebraska-football-side-riley-hire/

http://www.sbnation.com/college-foo...mike-riley-nebraska-football-players-reaction

 

[DropDimes]

DropDimes: way to early to tell where the program is going to go under Riley. Trouble is when a program reaches the top and can't stay. It was not that long ago that I took all kind of flack saying Tebow would not win the Heisman in his final season and that the Florida program was not going to be able to maintain it's position at the top of the heap. I was ridiculed for making those statements which were made way in advance of things going south for Tebow and the Gators. Is Riley the answer, I don't think so but we shall see. I think like Texas they settled for a new HC. All of the qualities that you are looking for are rare and hard to perpetuate. Those schools who do find someone who fits that bill do succeed. We shall see. BOL

Not sure how this has anything to do with anything I said, unless it was just a stand alone comment you were making?

 

[DropDimes]

It makes no sense?? Well, here goes:

-He was/is a mediocre/slightly above average coach (93-80 record, no PAC12 championships...or divisional championships). Add in his 13-34 NFL record and 40-32 CFL record and he has a career losing record as a head coach.

-He's old (for a new football coach), will be 62 in a week.

-No ties whatsoever to Nebraska....and barely any ties to the midwest, much less the Big 10 - which is a potential recruiting problem.

-In 14 seasons at Oregon State he won 10 games ONCE! ONE TIME!

-He's essentially a west coast coach; again, this is going to have implications on the recruiting trail.

-He's known as a "nice guy" (give me Saban, Spurrier, Urban Meyer, Harbaugh, Les Miles any day over a "nice guy" coach).

-Sub .500 conference record

-6 of his Oregon State teams didn't make a bowl game (in 14 seasons), almost half of his tenure...missing a bowl in 3 of his last 5 years.

-Oregon State fans are happy to see him leave (should tell you something)


Here's a few good article on hiring mediocrity (as I'm not the only one who thinks so...and I could post about 20 more of these same articles):

http://thelantern.com/2014/12/opini...y-shows-nebraskas-priorities-are-out-of-line/

http://www.pennlive.com/sports/index.ssf/2014/12/nebraskas_stunning_hire_of_ore.html

http://www.knowitallfootball.com/2014/12/05/nebraska-football-side-riley-hire/

http://www.sbnation.com/college-foo...mike-riley-nebraska-football-players-reaction

So you neglected to address any of the things I laid out as being valued by the university and the fan base? Spewing his Oregon St. stats does nothing for your argument. Again, the resources, facilities, and backing he will have at Nebraska by comparison are astronomical. You continue to make arguments that hold no water, and pretend you are right I guess. Wouldnt a better measure of Riley's tenure at Oregon St. be looking at how he did compared to his immediate predecessor? That would make far more sense than using his results there to try to predict how it translates to Nebraska.

OSU from 1991-96 and 99-2002: 44-69-1 Overall and 24-55-1 in the conference. 3 bowl games. 39% winning percentage.
OSU from 1997-98 and 03-14: 93-80 Overall and 58-63 in conference. 8 bowl games. 54% winning percentage.

Yeah, Riley sure was a disappointment at what you try to make out to be a powerhouse Oregon St. program. Let me ask this, what would have been more reasonable expectations for him at Oregon St.? Also, fair to say he fails to meet one criteria out of those I listed? Lastly, trust me, I can post multiple links that applaud the hire.

 

[cloverleaf]

My question on Riley is can he coach a defense up. Seems to me defense has not kept pace with
the offense the past few years. Last year, Nebraska's defense was average at best and many think
this season will be more of the same.

Riley is a good man, no question about that but I'm not sure he was the 'Best' hire Nebraska could
have found.

 

[RunLeeRun]

I wonder how many great coaches want to deal with the inherent recruiting disadvantages at Nebraska? I'm guessing the list is small. All the pressure, resources and fan buy in are there the same as any big-boy program. The players are not. I believe Nebraska spent more in recruiting last year than any other Big Ten team. That probably means they are spending more time on the road, more time away from campus and more effort just to squeek out a top 25 class. I don't think there are a lot of coaches that want to take that challenge even if the name means a lot still. Nebraska isn't a top 15 destination job because of that, so it has to be very careful about the type of hire it makes. It already did the up and coming, little experienced guy....who also had very little ties to Nebraska. I believe the job calls for an outside the box recruiter with a history of maxing out talent. If Riley doesn't fit that, I don't know who would. How he ever stayed afloat at Oregon State is beyond me especially with the giant up the road. I'm not sure what the expectations should be from Oregon State, but it isn't anywhere near close to where the rooting interests lie of his critics. Nebraska's a little easier to recruit to than Oregon State and it's not second fiddle in it's own state. If he's better than his Oregon State record or not, we'll find out soon over the next few years.

 

[DropDimes]

I wonder how many great coaches want to deal with the inherent recruiting disadvantages at Nebraska? I'm guessing the list is small. All the pressure, resources and fan buy in are there the same as any big-boy program. The players are not. I believe Nebraska spent more in recruiting last year than any other Big Ten team. That probably means they are spending more time on the road, more time away from campus and more effort just to squeek out a top 25 class. I don't think there are a lot of coaches that want to take that challenge even if the name means a lot still. Nebraska isn't a top 15 destination job because of that, so it has to be very careful about the type of hire it makes. It already did the up and coming, little experienced guy....who also had very little ties to Nebraska. I believe the job calls for an outside the box recruiter with a history of maxing out talent. If Riley doesn't fit that, I don't know who would. How he ever stayed afloat at Oregon State is beyond me especially with the giant up the road. I'm not sure what the expectations should be from Oregon State, but it isn't anywhere near close to where the rooting interests lie of his critics. Nebraska's a little easier to recruit to than Oregon State and it's not second fiddle in it's own state. If he's better than his Oregon State record or not, we'll find out soon over the next few years.

Oustanding post Lee and spot on. This is why throwing out comments like "I would take Saban, Harbaugh, Miles..." etc are pointless and ridiculous. Nebraska would love to have those guys, but sadly they aren't coming.

 

[DropDimes]

My question on Riley is can he coach a defense up. Seems to me defense has not kept pace with
the offense the past few years. Last year, Nebraska's defense was average at best and many think
this season will be more of the same.

Riley is a good man, no question about that but I'm not sure he was the 'Best' hire Nebraska could
have found.

This is the question that has Nebraska fans worried. The D has been pathetic for a few years and a lot of people chalk that up to Bo promoting his puppet Papuchis to DC tho he was drastically under qualified. Ross Els the previous LB coach was terrible too and didn't belong at he D1 level. He once told the media, I kid you not, "..they were doing some twisty things". All that said, Nebraska fans, myself included, are very weary of Hughes and Banker. The are easily the biggest question mark, and switching to a Quarters type D will be interesting. Bankers track record is better when he has better talent at Oregon St. historically speaking, so there is reason for hope, but no one is holding their breath.

 

[CoachCB]

So you neglected to address any of the things I laid out as being valued by the university and the fan base? Spewing his Oregon St. stats does nothing for your argument. Again, the resources, facilities, and backing he will have at Nebraska by comparison are astronomical. You continue to make arguments that hold no water, and pretend you are right I guess. Wouldnt a better measure of Riley's tenure at Oregon St. be looking at how he did compared to his immediate predecessor? That would make far more sense than using his results there to try to predict how it translates to Nebraska.

OSU from 1991-96 and 99-2002: 44-69-1 Overall and 24-55-1 in the conference. 3 bowl games. 39% winning percentage.
OSU from 1997-98 and 03-14: 93-80 Overall and 58-63 in conference. 8 bowl games. 54% winning percentage.

Yeah, Riley sure was a disappointment at what you try to make out to be a powerhouse Oregon St. program. Let me ask this, what would have been more reasonable expectations for him at Oregon St.? Also, fair to say he fails to meet one criteria out of those I listed? Lastly, trust me, I can post multiple links that applaud the hire.

Dude, I get it. You're a homer. I'm done with this discussion, as I might as well beat my head against a wall vs. arguing w/ a homer. But hey, good luck fella!

 

[russ1945]

Not sure how this has anything to do with anything I said, unless it was just a stand alone comment you were making?

Actually I was simply saying that even you don't know what will come down with Riley at the helm. I don't go out on a limb that often but I was emphatic about Florida not remaining dominant as long as most everyone else anticipated. You are more a less looking at this as a homer which is ok. But...and I emphasize....but.....there is not much to base your hopes on with Riley, mainly that he might be better in certain areas than Pelini. I started a thread addressing Oklahoma. Why don't you start one on Nebraska and take the time to prove your points with facts and figures. You rely awfully strongly on meeting values of the university and the fan base. What has he done since he got there etc. How are the players reacting to the change etc.
Worth a thread in my book.

 

[russ1945]

On page 104 of Steele's new preseason magazine he points out that only 2 HC's earned 9 or more wins from '08 thru '14, Saban who was awarded the most valuable contract ever and Pelini who was fired. Could be it is the university and some of the fan base are part of the problem. Last year three of those losses were by 5, 4, & 3 points. Just thought I would throw that in.

 

[SundayTiger]

I would like to bring up Texas AM for discussion.

I always look for who is going to surprise in the coming year and place a few long shot futures on them The one that keeps jumping out to me is Texas AM. I listen to Finebaum daily and not once have I heard anyone mention them as a team that can compete for the West title. Texas AM has had some phenomenal recruiting classes, and I would argue they have as much talent as anyone in the SEC. Their problem has always been defense and they made a home run hire in John Chavis as their new defensive coordinator. He will make a difference. They return Allen as their QB. The kid was highly recruited and young last year, he wasn't great overall, but he got much better at the end of the season. AM plays only 3 true road games (Ole miss, Vandy, and LSU). The SEC west is a bear of a division the schedule isn't easy, but I think it sets up fairly nice for them (2 weeks to prepare for Bama, with Bama coming off Arkansas game). The opener against AZ state is no gimmie but I like their chances playing in Texas.

At 18-1 to win the SEC, I think AM is worth a serious look.

 

[RunLeeRun]

On page 104 of Steele's new preseason magazine he points out that only 2 HC's earned 9 or more wins from '08 thru '14, Saban who was awarded the most valuable contract ever and Pelini who was fired. Could be it is the university and some of the fan base are part of the problem. Last year three of those losses were by 5, 4, & 3 points. Just thought I would throw that in.

Im one that has pointed that out. Its a select few that can say that and he did it as a rookie coach. It's impressive. I personaly think his firing was more to do with all the negativity surrounding his program. The chancelor wanted him gone since 2010 TAM and he knew it and lashed out at the fans and critics. When Osborne retired as AD it really took a toxic turn. It was bad. Now, if he'd have won just one conference title he still might be there. For all those wins not one title and also look at the losses during that span; 20+ to UCLA, Michigan and Ohio St. Losses of 31, 35 and 39 to Wisconsin, and all on national tv. When it wasnt that is was poking his finger at players, nearly striking refs, cursing and overall embarrasing himself and the entire state. Cameras focused on him for it, so it bacame a distraction. So I can say that I think it was much more about that than total wins. I think he's a grear DB coach and talent evaluator. His pass defenses and third down defenses were among some of the best, but his later versions began to hemorage in the run game. He was too stubborn to find help. When he had a chance to hire experienced coaches (like Stoops as DC) he hired the rookie grad assiatant he brought from LSU. He also hired a rookie OC. He failed at being CEO. I still think he has greatness in him as a coach, but it didnt work out for him.

 

[DropDimes]

Dude, I get it. You're a homer. I'm done with this discussion, as I might as well beat my head against a wall vs. arguing w/ a homer. But hey, good luck fella!

Thanks, good luck to you as well. I appreciate you addressing the questions I posed, as well as bringing up valuable statistical data.

 

[DropDimes]

Actually I was simply saying that even you don't know what will come down with Riley at the helm. I don't go out on a limb that often but I was emphatic about Florida not remaining dominant as long as most everyone else anticipated. You are more a less looking at this as a homer which is ok. But...and I emphasize....but.....there is not much to base your hopes on with Riley, mainly that he might be better in certain areas than Pelini. I started a thread addressing Oklahoma. Why don't you start one on Nebraska and take the time to prove your points with facts and figures. You rely awfully strongly on meeting values of the university and the fan base. What has he done since he got there etc. How are the players reacting to the change etc.
Worth a thread in my book.

I will gladly do so, but I think you and coach are off the mark with the "homer" comments. All I have said is that his hiring made sense. How on Earth is that being a homer? I didn't claim he will instantly turn things around, didn't claim he would have a incredible record year one, or anything else. It baffles me that people with little knowledge of the University and program itself think they are better at determine if a hire makes sense, than the fans of that institution, then can someone a homer for that...

Let me ask this, what determines if a hiring makes sense better than if someone matches he values of the university and what they expect from a coach?

 

[CoachCB]

On page 104 of Steele's new preseason magazine he points out that only 2 HC's earned 9 or more wins from '08 thru '14, Saban who was awarded the most valuable contract ever and Pelini who was fired. Could be it is the university and some of the fan base are part of the problem. Last year three of those losses were by 5, 4, & 3 points. Just thought I would throw that in.

Yep....and then you have a homer coming on here saying the hire "makes sense". It was the worst hire this off-season. If he was going to a lower level P5 school, I could see it. The Nebraska's of the world shouldn't settle for sub-.500 coaches who has only won 10 games 1 time in his career. But hey....some of the homers think it "makes sense"!!