I want to kill Bobby Bowden for kicking that last FG

bigbookie · Oct 17, 2008

Huego said:
It was a dumb call because if he missed it NC st gets the ball at midfield with 2 minutes left to win the game. Also there's more risk of a blocked FG with the longer attempts. A 52 yarder is very risky in a college game. I understand they have a good kicker but it's still a foolish play.

Smarter decision would of been to punt it.

exactly my thoughts-with a punt they would have to go 80+ yards with no timeouts and florida st defense was dominating them 2nd half-since it worked out for FSU it was the right call but had the fg been blocked for the game winning TD it was a bad call---I won both NC st and under---I am not saying these things because of my bet-Only chance NC st had was blocking the FG and bowden gave them that shot in my opinion. Just because you disagree with someone doest make them stupid-grow up-it is a discussion

sdf · Oct 17, 2008

bigbookie said:
exactly my thoughts-with a punt they would have to go 80+ yards with no timeouts and florida st defense was dominating them 2nd half-since it worked out for FSU it was the right call but had the fg been blocked for the game winning TD it was a bad call---I won both NC st and under---I am not saying these things because of my bet-Only chance NC st had was blocking the FG and bowden gave them that shot in my opinion. Just because you disagree with someone doest make them stupid-grow up-it is a discussion

1) Bowden had confidence in his kicker and SHOULD have confidence.
2) Punting from an opponent 35 likely results in touchback and NCSt would have the ball on the 20...a whopping 15 yards difference.
3) Bowden saw his defense was dominating NCSt so he was unbothered with NCSt actually scoring a TD. This gave him a chance to do 1) and put the game away

WTF do these teams do all spring, summer and fall that they cant try a 50 yd FG? NCSt punted from the FSU 33 on 4/long and didnt even think about putting up points. That shows a severe lack of confidence in your kicking game, your offense (maybe not so much as 4/long would have been hard to convert) and your defense. Poor coaching by O'Brien in this game.

bigbookie · Oct 17, 2008

sdf said:
1) Bowden had confidence in his kicker and SHOULD have confidence.
2) Punting from an opponent 35 likely results in touchback and NCSt would have the ball on the 20...a whopping 15 yards difference.
3) Bowden saw his defense was dominating NCSt so he was unbothered with NCSt actually scoring a TD. This gave him a chance to do 1) and put the game away

WTF do these teams do all spring, summer and fall that they cant try a 50 yd FG? NCSt punted from the FSU 33 on 4/long and didnt even think about putting up points. That shows a severe lack of confidence in your kicking game, your offense (maybe not so much as 4/long would have been hard to convert) and your defense. Poor coaching by O'Brien in this game.

definitely agree about O'Brien

rowdy · Oct 17, 2008

You guys are missing the dumbest call imo. Why did NC St go for it on 4th & 15 on their own 30 (something like that) with little over 3 minutes and 3 timeouts left? We wouldn't be talking about kickinng a FG had they punted. That was a lot bigger gamble to me than kicking a FG from 52 to go up 2 scores (with a K who was 2/3 on FG > 50). I thought for sure after NC St missed the 4th down conversion that FSU would score a TD the way they had been running the ball in the 2nd half.

bigtendominator · Oct 17, 2008

rowdy said:
You guys are missing the dumbest call imo. Why did NC St go for it on 4th & 15 on their own 30 (something like that) with little over 3 minutes and 3 timeouts left? We wouldn't be talking about kickinng a FG had they punted. That was a lot bigger gamble to me than kicking a FG from 52 to go up 2 scores (with a K who was 2/3 on FG > 50). I thought for sure after NC St missed the 4th down conversion that FSU would score a TD the way they had been running the ball in the 2nd half.

They weren't stopping FSU from getting a 1st down. Yes, I know your argument is they stopped them after they turned it over on downs, that is because FSU was in FG and their run playing calling had no variation. Had they been at their own 35 and the game on the line, they would have run different plays, not saying they would have thrown it.

bigtendominator · Oct 17, 2008

Here are Gano's numbers:

<TABLE border=0><TBODY><TR bgColor=#00008b><TD align=left bgColor=#00008b>FIELD GOALS </TD><TD align=middle bgColor=#00008b>Made-Att </TD><TD align=right bgColor=#00008b>Pct </TD><TD align=middle bgColor=#00008b>01-19 </TD><TD align=middle bgColor=#00008b>20-29 </TD><TD align=middle bgColor=#00008b>30-39 </TD><TD align=middle bgColor=#00008b>40-49 </TD><TD align=middle bgColor=#00008b>50-99 </TD><TD align=right bgColor=#00008b>Long </TD><TD align=right bgColor=#00008b>Blkd </TD></TR><TR bgColor=#ffffff><TD align=left> </TD><TD align=middle> </TD><TD align=right> </TD><TD align=middle> </TD><TD align=middle> </TD><TD align=middle> </TD><TD align=middle> </TD><TD align=middle> </TD><TD align=middle> </TD><TD align=middle> </TD></TR><TR bgColor=#ffffff><TD align=left>Gano, G </TD><TD align=middle>6-7 </TD><TD align=right>85.7 </TD><TD align=middle>0-0 </TD><TD align=middle>0-0 </TD><TD align=middle>3-3 </TD><TD align=middle>1-1 </TD><TD align=middle>2-3 </TD><TD align=middle>53 </TD><TD align=middle>0 </TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE>

It wasn't like he hadn't made a 50 yarder before.

You ask any coach, if you have a kicker that has already made a 50 yarder this year and you have a chance to ice a game or punt, play defense and be up by less than a TD and net 15 to 20 yards on a punt, which do you think they are going to do?

duckhunter · Oct 17, 2008

that was the right call all the way...........and i had fl. st. -11.

709 · Oct 17, 2008

whormoan said:
It absolutely was the wrong call. Easy to say not when the FG was made. A 53 yd FG is not even a 50/50 proposition in college. Let's assume FSU had punted. Even a bad punt would've made NC ST start at the 15 yd line with no TO's and a QB who can't throw. A missed FG would've put the ball close to midfield with momentum on the Wolfpack side. Not to mention long kicks are often blocked.

You are half correct, assume FG was failed or punting the ball with more than minutes left could cost dearly for FSU if NCST could score quick. My opinion is Bowden should go for 4th down at 36th yard. Game could be ended if they make it or the ball should place at near 30 yardline.

Illini · Oct 17, 2008

Huego said:
It was a dumb call because if he missed it NC st gets the ball at midfield with 2 minutes left to win the game. Also there's more risk of a blocked FG with the longer attempts. A 52 yarder is very risky in a college game. I understand they have a good kicker but it's still a foolish play.

Smarter decision would of been to punt it.

Oh, bullshit. You put the dagger in while you have the chance. FG was game over. Of course you kick it.

Illini · Oct 17, 2008

rowdy said:
You guys are missing the dumbest call imo. Why did NC St go for it on 4th & 15 on their own 30 (something like that) with little over 3 minutes and 3 timeouts left? We wouldn't be talking about kickinng a FG had they punted. That was a lot bigger gamble to me than kicking a FG from 52 to go up 2 scores (with a K who was 2/3 on FG > 50). I thought for sure after NC St missed the 4th down conversion that FSU would score a TD the way they had been running the ball in the 2nd half.

Exactly. NC St should have punted, and there's no question about that. Kicking the FG was the only decision that Bowden could make. A complete no-brainer.

Illini · Oct 17, 2008

bigtendominator said:
They lost and are stupid.

:lol::aktion033:toast:

Yep. Pretty much.

ArizonaBound · Oct 17, 2008

Huego said:
It was a dumb call because if he missed it NC st gets the ball at midfield with 2 minutes left to win the game. Also there's more risk of a blocked FG with the longer attempts. A 52 yarder is very risky in a college game. I understand they have a good kicker but it's still a foolish play.

Smarter decision would of been to punt it.

I agree with this statement. The likelyhood of a made FG in college from 50+ is not good. A punt or 4 straight running plays was the smarter play in my opinion. Anyone see Philly and the 49ers last week. 50+ yarder at the half that was blocked and returned for a TD. Ohio St and Michigan St a couple years back, same thing. Too high risk with small chance at reward. It worked, doesn't mean I'd do it again.

Just not a smart coaching decision. What was even dumber in my opinion was dropping the QB back instead of 3 hard running plays to put yourself in positon for a 40 yarder instead of a 52 yarder. The 3 plays leading up to the FG were piss poor coaching.

az

ArizonaBound · Oct 17, 2008

oh yeah, add in the 4th and 15 where ncstate should have punted with 3 min. left. 4th and 5 probably go for it. not 15 yards. Even if it worked would still not advise doing it again.

Illini · Oct 17, 2008

Arizona Bound said:
I agree with this statement. The likelyhood of a made FG in college from 50+ is not good. A punt or 4 straight running plays was the smarter play in my opinion. Anyone see Philly and the 49ers last week. 50+ yarder at the half that was blocked and returned for a TD. Ohio St and Michigan St a couple years back, same thing. Too high risk with small chance at reward. It worked, doesn't mean I'd do it again.

Just not a smart coaching decision. What was even dumber in my opinion was dropping the QB back instead of 3 hard running plays to put yourself in positon for a 40 yarder instead of a 52 yarder. The 3 plays leading up to the FG were piss poor coaching.

az

Dropping back to pass was dumb, no doubt about that. But kicking a long FG to seal the game, which is well within your kicker's range......easy decision. You go for the dagger that seals the game and is a very makeable kick. You don't keep the other team in the game and pick up a few yards of field position. Jugular.

TOOTIGHT · Oct 17, 2008

There is no right or wrong in this scenario. It was risky giving NCST that field position if he would have missed but who wants to risk giving them the ball back? Can't really criticize the call either way.

The announcers were saying "great call!!" but if he would have missed they would have torched him and said they would of punted it.

ArizonaBound · Oct 17, 2008

we can agree to disagree, but the field position on a miss was not my strongest arguement for not kicking the fg. up 6 with a blocked fg and good return or return for a TD and you lose this game most likely.
NO idea but would be interested to see stats on number of 50+ yard field goals that are blocked at the college level.
I believe it was Bobby just trying to show everyone that he finally has a kicker that can kick. He likely played to his ego rather than the percentages

709 · Oct 17, 2008

Arizona Bound said:
we can agree to disagree, but the field position on a miss was not my strongest arguement for not kicking the fg. up 6 with a blocked fg and good return or return for a TD and you lose this game most likely.
NO idea but would be interested to see stats on number of 50+ yard field goals that are blocked at the college level.
I believe it was Bobby just trying to show everyone that he finally has a kicker that can kick. He likely played to his ego rather than the percentages

Good point, that is a type of he is !

bigtendominator · Oct 17, 2008

Arizona Bound said:
we can agree to disagree, but the field position on a miss was not my strongest arguement for not kicking the fg. up 6 with a blocked fg and good return or return for a TD and you lose this game most likely.

Based on the logic of a block more than field position is a logical argument. I can not agree with anyone saying not to kick it because of field position, but when you have a chance to end it, you do.

I believe that many coaches would have kicked it, even with a shaky kicker to go up 9.

Mr.Smith · Oct 17, 2008

you gain maybe 20 yds on average by punting. if the FG is good, game over. if its no good, they have to drive 65 yds with a bad offense vs a pretty good defense. you definately take your shot to end the game with a FG there.

block and return for TD, some of you guys need to get jobs as announcers! they love to talk about that one like its a serious problem. In reality its extremely rare.

this decision with such a good kicker isnt EVEN CLOSE. this thread does help to separate the clueless from the not clueless around here.

You do not trade a chance to lock the game up for 20 yds of field position. That is Dave Wannstedt type stupidity.

ArizonaBound · Oct 17, 2008

Mr. Smith said:
you gain maybe 20 yds on average by punting. if the FG is good, game over. if its no good, they have to drive 65 yds with a bad offense vs a pretty good defense. you definately take your shot to end the game with a FG there.

block and return for TD, some of you guys need to get jobs as announcers! they love to talk about that one like its a serious problem. In reality its extremely rare.

this decision with such a good kicker isnt EVEN CLOSE. this thread does help to separate the clueless from the not clueless around here.

You do not trade a chance to lock the game up for 20 yds of field position. That is Dave Wannstedt type stupidity.

Again, field position is one thing, but the potential for block is the other. Even if we assume that 20 yards is all that is gained with a punt. 20 yards is huge with 2 minutes left and no timeouts.

Please define extremely rare? You are telling me that 52 yard field goals blocked in college is extemely rare? I would argue that 52 yard field goals are very rare makes in the college game, but I am only guessing and willing to admit that. Your comments above come across much more arrogant and ignorant and I am left wondering who is the clueless one.
Sure, you can pat yourself on the back the day after when it worked out the way your arguement supports but I suspect a different outcome would have you talking a little different.
No need to respond as I have a family waiting on me and won't be around to read it. good day

az