Decriminalising Pot in Canada: for Floyd

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An older article that explains the proposed law:

Tuesday :: May 27, 2003

Canada Introduces Pot Legalization Measure

Canada proposed a new marijuana law Tuesday that decriminalizes up to 15 grams of marijuana. Offenders would receive a citation similar to a traffic ticket and pay a fine. There would be no criminal record attached to paying the citation.


Those under 18 years old could face fines of up to $182 for minor possession while adults could be fined the equivalent of $292. At the same time, the maximum sentence for illegal growers would be increased to 14 years in prison from the current seven, while trafficking would remain punishable by up to life in prison.


Justice Minister Martin Cauchon said the law includes an education, research and treatment program aimed at persuading young people against drug use. The government intends to spend $179 million on the program.

Other issues regarding Canada's pot laws have yet to be resolved.


Canada's Supreme Court is considering a constitutional challenge to
laws that make it illegal to possess pot, and Ontario courts have
declared the federal law against possession to be invalid because of
legal questions.

The U.S., particularly Drug Czar John Walters, is upset with Canada for proposing to liberalize marijuana laws. The U.S. has threatened increased border searches if the bill becomes law. As we reported here last week:


Last week, U.S. drug czar John Walters suggested border traffic would slow to a crawl because the U.S. would increase inspections to stop smugglers from illegally shipping "poison" south.


Will Glaspy, a U.S. Drug Enforcement Agency spokesman, told The Detroit News yesterday that talk of decriminalizing pot in Canada would mean "more customs, more border patrols, more DEA. (source article here)

You can read the text of the Canadian bill here. A background briefing paper on the bill is here.

Ari Fleischer, asked about the bill at today's press briefing, gave his usual non-response:


Q Ari, the Canadian government, this morning, introduced legislation that will decriminalize marijuana. What is the administration's position? Should Canada expect any repercussions, like border delays? And did President Bush speak about this with Prime Minister Chretien?


MR. FLEISCHER: I don't believe that was a topic that came up in their conversation. It certainly was not in the notes that were given to me. And that's a position the President has not supported here.

We think the bill's proposed growing and trafficking penalties are way too steep. As to the decriminalization of small amounts for simple possession, we don't see what the U.S. is so concerned about. Many U.S. states have had a ticket system in place for minor possession of pot for years. For example, in Colorado, up to one ounce is a petty offense punishable by a $100 fine. Jail is not an option. True, marijuana possession shouldn't be an offense at all, but we wonder if the Canadian compromise is worth it given the unduly harsh (up to 14 years and life, respectively) growing and selling sentences under consideration.
 

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Drugs destroy people.
 

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This article uses the words "proposed"" and "introduced". Is the law in effect right now or not? If not, why not?
 

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Floyd,
What are your thoughts on drug laws and punishment?

I feel that the punishments are too harsh, but that the laws themselves are appropriate.
 

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Lander,

I believe drugs should be legalized.

The war on drugs is a waste of time and money.

I believe in social Darwinism. If a person, Canadian or American, wants to destroy themselves with drugs, then so be it. But don't expect me to pay for their rehab.
 

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It would appear that the official vote is to be held in Parliament this week, although in theory, the drug is already decriminalised. For years, Canadian Chiefs of Police have been advocating its decriminalisation, and I doubt that there are many Canadians who oppose it.

I received a $57.50 fine last month for possession of 1/8 ounce, just to give you an idea of where the law enforcement officials stand on the issue.

DRUG WAR BRIEFS: Canadian Law Reform
By Kevin Nelson, AlterNet
January 20, 2003

January 10- The Toronto Star reports: Ottawa has been given six months to come up with a way of ensuring sick Canadians have access to medical marijuana - including the possibility of setting up regulated distribution centres - or simple possession of the drug will become legal in Ontario, if not all of Canada, legal experts say.

In a long-awaited decision released yesterday, an Ontario Superior Court judge struck down federal rules governing access to medical marijuana, finding them unconstitutional because they force seriously ill people who use pot as medicine to break the law to obtain the drug.

"Laws which put seriously ill, vulnerable people in a position where they have to deal with the criminal underworld to obtain medicine they have been authorized to take violate the constitutional right to security of the person," Justice Sidney Lederman said.

Last month, a House of Commons committee recommended that people be allowed to possess up to 30 grams of marijuana without risking criminal penalties.

Young said the biggest obstacle to decriminalization in Canada is U.S. opposition - a view shared by many marijuana crusaders. "That is the only obstacle," said Mark Emery of the B.C. Marijuana Party. "There is no real internal opposition in Canada any more."

U.S. drug czar John Walters has warned that the United States might tighten security along its northern border to prevent a surge in contraband cannabis if Canadian laws are eased.

There appears to be widespread acceptance in Canada on the need for drug reform. Even the right-wing Fraser Institute advocates decriminalization of marijuana.
 

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<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by lander:
Drugs destroy people.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Not necessarily untrue, not necessarily true. Lumping pot with cocaine, heroin, crack, etc. is ridiculous, especially in a society which allows the consumption of alcohol. As someone who owns a bar and has been in the business for years, I can tell you that drunks are a greater threat to society than potheads. I think the current stance on pot (moreso in the US than in Canada) is far too harsh given our lax stance on booze.
 

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So this is not law yet?

So in the other thread when you said "Canada recently de-criminalized marijuana..." that wasn't really accurate was it?

Please keep us updated on the passage of this measure.
 

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Given my personal experience, I thought they had. My fine read 'possession.' Anyway, as I said, it's more or less only a formality at this point. The law enforcement officials are treating it as though it has been decriminalised.

What are your thoughts on the relationship between Canada and the US if this becomes official law?
 

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<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Floyd Gondolli:
Lander,

I believe drugs should be legalized.

The war on drugs is a waste of time and money.

I believe in social Darwinism. If a person, Canadian or American, wants to destroy themselves with drugs, then so be it. But don't expect me to pay for their rehab.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

I'd be all for that, but the problem is that you know the rest of us end up paying for it one way or another. It the shit is legal they destroy themselves and milk all the social programs available, and it there are no social programs then they'll resort to crime which not only endangers us - but we get stuck with the bill for that too.

I don't know man ... it's fuks like the crackheads that destroy the true intent of socialist programs.
 

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XPanda,
All the people that I know that do acid, coke, etc .. all started with weed.

They're certainly not the same, but I fully agree with the "gateway" theory.
 

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I agree, under the current system we pay for others' addictions, but I say legalize all drugs and if someone gets addicted, its their problem - no govt. money.

If someone commits another crime on drugs, put them away for sure, but just possessing and using the drugs should not be a crime.
 

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xpanda, given my position on the leaglization of drugs, Canada's position doesn't concern me. I just believe that the US and Canada should be concerned with each other's laws given the border situation. The particular law, whether it deals with guns or drugs etc. is irrelevant.
 

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<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by lander:
XPanda,
All the people that I know that do acid, coke, etc .. all started with weed.

They're certainly not the same, but I fully agree with the "gateway" theory.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Lander, while most coke users may have started with weed, it does not automatically follow that most weed users will eventually become coke users.

I don't know too many people who have never smoked up before, but I know tons of people who have never done a line before. Hell, many of my friends are police officers and most of them have or still do smoke pot. If drugs are going to be given distinction, then pot should be placed in the same category as alcohol, no question. Or do you also concede that most coke users started off with booze?
 

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I'd go for that approach, given the condition that if we see an extreme increase in drug-user related crimes then we redesign the system (which, I guess, already happens in our current system).
 

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I'd say give it a try. If it is a disaster then tweak it or even repeal it. But I think something needs to be done because the drug war has virtually destroyed our Justice System.
 

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Sh!t, Those liberals up in Canada our going to be a smokin a little hempster now, eh?. That's OK it will be the lazy, social welfare bums doing most of the smokin anyway. I guess they are going to be even lazier now. Maybe so lazy that they'll quit stealing the tax payers money even. Like I said, Give a canuk a cae of beer, a case of whiskey, and a 1955 Lund 14 foot aluminum boot with a 15 horse Merc and they think that they have died and gone to heaven. Throw a little weed in to the brains and they'll now want the 25 horsepower Johnson but will be to lazy to strive to get it.
 

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From Northern Minnesota eh? You might as well be Canadian. You have more in common with them than you do with the rest of the continental US.
 

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he has nothing in common with canadians except for weather...northern minnesota is the most backwards place on God's green earth.... makes buttfukk Mississippi look like NYC.....
 

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I think about 11 states already have pot decriminalized. I know California and where I live now, Oregon, does. The laws might be better in these states than the current laws in Canada, but the police don't enforce them in Canada. That creates more pot freedom there.
 

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