American Healthcare System Not What Obambi Says

[kcameron95]

I don't think there is much argument that the U.S. supports much more of an immigrant and minority population than most other countries.

Canada has 1/5 of the population born outside of Canada (largest in the western world). And its not only Europeans. Europeans only make up 40% of these immigrants. In fact majority of new immigrants are coming from China/India/Pakistan/Philippines. Surprisingly this is only 1/10 for the US.

I got this from http://www.thestar.com/News/Canada/article/282347.

 

[Ricboff]

Canada has 1/5 of the population born outside of Canada (largest in the western world). And its not only Europeans. Europeans only make up 40% of these immigrants. In fact majority of new immigrants are coming from China/India/Pakistan/Philippines. Surprisingly this is only 1/10 for the US.

I got this from http://www.thestar.com/News/Canada/article/282347.

yes indeed, I knew immigrants as a % of pop are much higher in Canada then in US. I actually dont even care about that----- i'm looking for data to support his claim that immigrants are hurting US healthcare numbers ( note that he didnt actually say which number(s) he is refering to, i'm unsure).

 

[Mistermj]

that is not my query

my query, again is:

you stated the following-- "The health of our larger minority populations and new immigrants pulls down many of the other numbers"

you belivee that the immigrants coming to USA are of poor health compared to the natives and hence 'bring down US health care' data relative to other industrial countries

i'm asking do you have numerical data to support this?

thks

If you are going to leave out half of my statement...whats the point?

"The health of our larger minority populations and...

 

[barman]

good work Richoff....Pwned Joe Jr before even getting to Page 2

 

[kingbill]

If you are going to leave out half of my statement...whats the point?

"The health of our larger minority populations and...

You never even proved the other half, it should be dependent on you to prove your asinine statements instead of force everyone else to disprove it.

 

[Ricboff]

If you are going to leave out half of my statement...whats the point?

"The health of our larger minority populations and...

please understand, no agenda from me. I'm not trying to 'win' anything. I found the second part of your statement difficult to grasp. I would like to know if it was pure opinion or based on some quantitative study.

that's all

 

[Willie99]

we have an estimated 12 to 20 million illegal immigrants in the states. Since we provide them with our customary health care on demand, they obviously are quite a burden on our health care system.

as far as Canadian immigration goes, I believe Canada has been more receptive to accepting legal immigrants than the USA has over the last few decades, I think it's about population policy, and our neighbors to the north want(ed) more people.

funny thing is, going to Canada first is the route many immigrants would take to get into the states.

 

[Dave007inVegas]

When your health care overhaul isn’t going well, here’s what you do. First you place blame….

President Barack Obama on Friday blamed headline-hungry television networks for enflaming an ugly backlash by foes of his top priority effort to offer health care to all Americans.

President Obama on Friday accused some insurance companies of trying to undermine his plans for overhauling health care by “funding in opposition,” a comment that could inflame tensions at a time when Mr. Obama is hoping to keep insurers at the negotiating table.

And if that doesn’t work, you do what you best, you spend and scratch backs.

Aug. 15 (Bloomberg) -- Two firms that received $343.3 million to handle advertising for Barack Obama’s White House run last year have profited from his top priority as president by taking on his push for health-care overhaul.

One is AKPD Message and Media, the Chicago-based firm headed by David Axelrod until he left last Dec. 31 to serve as a senior adviser to the president. Axelrod was Obama’s top campaign strategist and is now helping sell the health-care plan. The other firm is Washington-based GMMB Campaign Group, where partner Jim Margolis was also an Obama strategist.

It’s pretty fucking sad when you need to hire advertising firms to push your agenda because it can’t stand up to the scrutiny of the American people.

@)

 

[kingbill]

we have an estimated 12 to 20 million illegal immigrants in the states. Since we provide them with our customary health care on demand, they obviously are quite a burden on our health care system.

as far as Canadian immigration goes, I believe Canada has been more receptive to accepting legal immigrants than the USA has over the last few decades, I think it's about population policy, and our neighbors to the north want(ed) more people.

funny thing is, going to Canada first is the route many immigrants would take to get into the states.

I would like to see numbers on this

 

[Ricboff]

I second that. Please provide link willie99

thks in advance

we have an estimated 12 to 20 million illegal immigrants in the states. Since we provide them with our customary health care on demand, they obviously are quite a burden on our health care system.



this is not what i'm askign about.

again, he stated this: "The health of our larger minority populations and new immigrants pulls down many of the other numbers"


--mistermj is implying that the immigrants to USA are adversely affecting US national healthcare numbers as compared to other industrial nations. I am looking for evidence for this. Minority populations and immigrants are not the same thinig (see native American indians as an example).

no evidence has come, so i'm going to assume this is just opinion and not fact. Interestingly enough one could argue that the incoming immigrants are GOOD for National Healthcare numbers in certain areas (heart disease, diabetes), given USA is amonsgt the highest in obesity as a % of pop (Mexico and UK right up there).

 

[Mistermj]

I second that. Please provide link willie99

thks in advance

we have an estimated 12 to 20 million illegal immigrants in the states. Since we provide them with our customary health care on demand, they obviously are quite a burden on our health care system.



this is not what i'm askign about.

again, he stated this: "The health of our larger minority populations and new immigrants pulls down many of the other numbers"


--mistermj is implying that the immigrants to USA are adversely affecting US national healthcare numbers as compared to other industrial nations. I am looking for evidence for this. Minority populations and immigrants are not the same thinig (see native American indians as an example).

no evidence has come, so i'm going to assume this is just opinion and not fact. Interestingly enough one could argue that the incoming immigrants are GOOD for National Healthcare numbers in certain areas (heart disease, diabetes), given USA is amonsgt the highest in obesity as a % of pop (Mexico and UK right up there).

Minority Population Tops 100 Million

The nation's minority population reached 100.7 million, according to the national and state estimates by race, Hispanic origin, sex and age released today by the U.S. Census Bureau. A year ago, the minority population totaled 98.3 million.

"About one in three U.S. residents is a minority," said Census Bureau Director Louis Kincannon. "To put this into perspective, there are more minorities in this country today than there were people in the United States in 1910. In fact, the minority population in the U.S. is larger than the total population of all but 11 countries."

US Census Press Releases (15 August 2009)
http://www.census.gov/Press-Release/www/releases/archives/population/010048.html

 

[kingbill]

Minority Population Tops 100 Million

The nation's minority population reached 100.7 million, according to the national and state estimates by race, Hispanic origin, sex and age released today by the U.S. Census Bureau. A year ago, the minority population totaled 98.3 million.

"About one in three U.S. residents is a minority," said Census Bureau Director Louis Kincannon. "To put this into perspective, there are more minorities in this country today than there were people in the United States in 1910. In fact, the minority population in the U.S. is larger than the total population of all but 11 countries."

US Census Press Releases (15 August 2009)
http://www.census.gov/Press-Release/www/releases/archives/population/010048.html

Sure the US has a lot of visible minorities but you still didn't answer the question...@)

 

[barman]

we have an estimated 12 to 20 million illegal immigrants in the states. Since we provide them with our customary health care on demand,

ER services is about all that most illegal residents are going to get within most of the USA. Otherwise, they're pretty much like the bulk of Americans who - if they don't have the proper health insurance paid for - will be denied access to desired health care and hospital care.

 

[barman]

It’s pretty fucking sad when you need to hire advertising firms to push your agenda because it can’t stand up to the scrutiny of the American people.

Admittedly, the exxagerated influence of pharmaceutical dealers and health insurance providers spending billions to promote obstruction of sensible reform does coax a tear from the eye for those of us who aren't covered by a state-based health care program or a union-negotiated package.

 

[barman]

--mistermj is implying that the immigrants to USA are adversely affecting US national healthcare numbers as compared to other industrial nations. I am looking for evidence for this. Minority populations and immigrants are not the same thinig (see native American indians as an example).

Astute point. In fact, most of the populations deemed "minority" within the USA are "majority" populations in other industrialized nations.

So if they are presumed to "bring down" the overall health within the USA, why then would they not even moreso bring down the overall health within their native countries?

 

[Mistermj]

Admittedly, the exxagerated influence of pharmaceutical dealers and health insurance providers spending billions to promote obstruction of sensible reform does coax a tear from the eye for those of us who aren't covered by a state-based health care program or a union-negotiated package.

I think we can all agree...Barman doesn't have the slightest clue what he is talking about. It's all about the post count.

Obama's health care plan helped by drug industry

Assist from drug industry in trying to help Obama remake the nation's health care system

DAVID ESPO
AP News

Aug 08, 2009 08:35 EST

The nation's drugmakers stand ready to spend $150 million to help President Barack Obama overhaul health care this fall, according to numerous officials, a staggering sum that could dwarf attempts to derail his chief domestic priority.

The White House and allies in Congress are well aware of the effort by Pharmaceutical Research and Manufacturers of America, a somewhat surprising political alliance, given the industry's recent history of siding with Republicans and the Democrats' disdain for special interests.
Obama's health care plan helped by drug industry | TPM News Pages (15 August 2009)
http://www.talkingpointsmemo.com/news/2009/08/obamas_health_care_plan_helped_by_drug_industry.php

 

[barman]

Now you're starting to get it

The drug companies and health insurance companies have the strongest influence on what will eventually come out of Wash DC with regards to "reforming" national health care options

These two industries have no particular lean towards either "Obama" or "the Republican opposition". Once you glom onto that truth, you'll better understand why I and many others are not wasting a lot of time pointing fingers at either "Obama/Dems" or "Republicans" with regard to who is most likely to fuck this whole process up

I stated clearly in last post that the pharm dealers and health insurance dealers are all about "obstructing sensible reform".

Made no claim that they were obstructing Obama or any other individual political faction

 

[barman]

Should note that I do, in fact, remain very receptive to being "paid by the post".

Interested parties should submit their offers to me via PM asap

 

[Willie99]

ER services is about all that most illegal residents are going to get within most of the USA. Otherwise, they're pretty much like the bulk of Americans who - if they don't have the proper health insurance paid for - will be denied access to desired health care and hospital care.

TX 1.3 billion dollars
CA 10.5 billion dollars annually

any questions?

http://usgovinfo.about.com/od/immigrationnaturalizatio/a/caillegals.htm

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I somewhat surprised i even need to defend yet another totally accurate statement. I foolishly assumed everyone new this to be true

hno:
:lol:
@)

 

[barman]

TX 1.3 billion dollars
CA 10.5 billion dollars annually

any questions?

http://usgovinfo.about.com/od/immigrationnaturalizatio/a/caillegals.htm

------------------------------------------------------------

Those "B" numbers sure sound big.

But do nothing to demonstrate support for the earlier claim that "illegal immigrants are provided our customary health care on demand"...a phrasing which implies that illegals have easy access to all the health care customarily enjoyed by legal residents.

In fact, few have access to all the health care to which we as legal residents have customary access.

IF illegals actually enjoyed such access, those numbers you cite above would likely be 10x as high.