'All Things Neteller. (including a Poll).'.

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WIll Neteller ultimately stiff US account holders

  • YES

    Votes: 40 23.8%
  • NO

    Votes: 33 19.6%
  • will slowpay a good bit but will eventually pay out all

    Votes: 81 48.2%
  • only those who have a Neteller ATM card will get their money

    Votes: 14 8.3%

  • Total voters
    168

RX Prophet
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I assume they're meaning 5:45 PM today UK time? Unless I'm converting my time zones incorrectly its now 6:30 PM in London.......
 

hangin' about
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da1prophet said:
I assume they're meaning 5:45 PM today UK time? Unless I'm converting my time zones incorrectly its now 6:30 PM in London.......

Yeah... guessing it's just taking some time to hit the internet.
 

Rx. Veteran
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Now I'm reading that they WERE arrested. Anyways, there's a statement coming out from authoriies later today. If they get to open Neteller's books, I hope you all have been paying taxes on your Neteller transactions like I have been.
 

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Handicapper
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While I wouldn't to have money in neteller right now I am not writing off the entire offshore industry. People in the US want to bet and ARE GOING TO BET no matter what the government tries to do. There WILL ALWAYS be intermediaries. So long as my money is in an "A" rated sportsbook I am not nervous. If it means that they have to cut checks through a third party they will ALWAYS find a way.
 

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Fat Tony said:
Spin it??? Think for a second before the "chicken little" panic. This is what the gov has to do to screw with Neteller. Bring in people who don't even work there anymore. What are they going to nail these guys on that has anything to do with Neteller right now???????

It's like a CSI episode. They think a guy is a serial killer, they have no proof, so they bring in the guy's brother for questioning to shake him up. :lolBIG:

It's bs. Relax.
Tony it would be like if someone wanted to know who the Mush was going with and he was no where to be found so they then got a hold of you and asked what would the Mush do in this situation... no? By the way is the Mush any where to be found??
 

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Money laundering . The governement will use this law intended to protect you against terror to snoop into all aspects of your life. The charges wont stand up but by then it will be too late.
Never ever give the government more powers. They will always promise to use the power wisely but never will.
 

hangin' about
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Neteller BREAKING NEWS UPDATE

Neteller founders Stephen Lawrence and John Lefebvre have been charged with money laundering charges by the US Attorney General in the Southern District of New York.

A statement from the office of Michael Garcia added that Lawrence and Lefebvre had been arrested in connection with the “creation and operation of an internet payment services company that facilitated the transfer of billions of dollars of illegal gambling proceeds from US citizens to the owners of various internet gambling companies located overseas.”

Lawrence was arrested yesterday in the US Virgin Islands and will be presented in federal court in St Thomas by tomorrow. Lefebvre was arrested in Malibu, California and will be presented in a Los Angeles court later today.

Lawrence and Lefebvre were arrested in the early hours of Monday morning, January 15.

Neteller suspended its share price this morning as the news broke.

In a statement released earlier today, Neteller said neither Lawrence or Lefebvre had any current position within the company. The statement added: “The group has not received any communication or correspondence from any US authority regarding this or any related matter.”

Lebebvre left Neteller in December 2005 while Lawrence left in October last year, just after the passing of the Unlawful Internet Gaming Enforcement Act.

The news of the Neteller arrests spelt more bad news for those operators that have not exited the US.

Said one legal source: “It’s a warning shot across the bows for those still taking money from the US.”

He added: “They are aiming their strategy at the finance provision. It is consistent with the Unlawful Internet Gambling Enforcement Act (UIGEA). It is a more effective strategy than going after the operators themselves, such as PokerStars. When you get the money providers, you get the portfolio of operators.”

One leading operator suggested this was particularly bad news for those poker operators that remain in the US market. “This could be terminal for the poker business in the US. The average punter won’t be willing to jump through the hoops (to get their payments through).”

http://www.egrmagazine.com/item/1534/23/5/3
 

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Kenny B said:
While I wouldn't to have money in neteller right now I am not writing off the entire offshore industry. People in the US want to bet and ARE GOING TO BET no matter what the government tries to do. There WILL ALWAYS be intermediaries. So long as my money is in an "A" rated sportsbook I am not nervous. If it means that they have to cut checks through a third party they will ALWAYS find a way.

Dont need to make it impsossible. Just too difficult for the 95% of people who cant be bothered with complicated solutions.

Just look at Intertops' solution. I wont bother with all that ****
 
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wow, thats the court my team here in D.C. works with. the 2nd circuit at the SDNY. Got Michael Garcia's e-mail address right in front of me
 

LA Clippers Junkie
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Tubby2000 said:
Dont need to make it impsossible. Just too difficult for the 95% of people who cant be bothered with complicated solutions.

Exactly.

What people don't seem to understand is the squares/recreational players are not going to jump through hoops to get their money offshore. They will hear news like this and just go back to playing with a local or not bet at all.

These are the players that keep the books afloat. The only players that will go through anything to get their money to these books are the players the books don't want. Books will not be able to turn a profit taking bets from a clientelle of strictly sharp players. Everyone relies on recreational bettors to keep the industry going.
 

Rx. Veteran
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I hope you all have been declaring your Neteller payouts, like I've been saying you should do all along.
 

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just posted at MW

United States Attorney
Southern District of New York
FOR IMMEDIATE RELEASE CONTACT: U.S. ATTORNEY’S OFFICE
January 16, 2007 YUSILL SCRIBNER,
REBEKAH CARMICHAEL
PUBLIC INFORMATION OFFICE
(212) 637-2600
FBI
NEIL DONOVAN, JAMES MARGOLIN
PUBLIC INFORMATION OFFICE
(212) 384-2715, 2720
U.S. CHARGES TWO FOUNDERS OF PAYMENT SERVICES COMPANY
WITH LAUNDERING BILLIONS OF DOLLARS OF
INTERNET GAMBLING PROCEEDS
MICHAEL J. GARCIA, the United States Attorney for the
Southern District of New York, and MARK J. MERSHON, the Assistant
Director-in-Charge of the New York Office of the Federal Bureau of
Investigation ("FBI"), announced today that STEPHEN ERIC LAWRENCE
and JOHN DAVID LEFEBVRE were arrested yesterday in connection with
the creation and operation of an internet payment services company
that facilitated the transfer of billions of dollars of illegal
gambling proceeds from United States citizens to the owners of
various internet gambling companies located overseas. According to
the two criminal Complaints unsealed yesterday:
Neteller PLC ("Neteller"), formerly known as Neteller,
Inc., is an internet payment services company that was founded by
LAWRENCE and LEFEBVRE in 1999. Neteller is based in the Isle of
Man and is publicly traded in the United Kingdom. Neteller began
processing internet gambling transactions in approximately July
2000. Internet payment services companies, like Neteller, allow
gambling companies to transfer money collected from United States
customers to bank accounts outside the United States. According to
Neteller’s 2005 annual report, LAWRENCE and LEFEBVRE, through
Neteller, provided payment services to more than 80% of worldwide
gaming merchants.
Since founding Neteller, LAWRENCE and LEFEBVRE have held
numerous senior management positions at the company. For instance,
LAWRENCE served as Chief Executive Officer of Neteller until
December 2002; as executive director of Neteller from 2001 to

-2-
August 31, 2003; and as Chairman of the Board of Directors of
Neteller until May 11, 2006. LAWRENCE left the Board of Directors
on October 13, 2006. LEFEBVRE served as President of Neteller from
2000 to 2002; and was a member of the Board of Directors until
approximately December 2005.
Furthermore, LAWRENCE and LEFEBVRE have both held
significant ownership interests in Neteller. As of December 31,
2004, LAWRENCE was the largest shareholder of Neteller, owning
21.94% of the outstanding shares of Neteller PLC. As of the same
date, LEFEBVRE was the second-largest shareholder of Neteller PLC,
owning 13.44% of the outstanding shares of the company.
At the time that the defendants took Neteller public, the
company acknowledged in its offering documents that United States
law prohibited persons from promoting certain forms of gambling,
including internet gambling, and transmitting funds that are known
to have been derived from criminal activity or are intended to
promote criminal activity. The company’s directors, including
LAWRENCE and LEFEBVRE, also conceded that they were risking
prosecution by the government of the United States under existing
or future federal laws.
In 2005, Neteller processed over $7.3 billion in
financial transactions. According to reports issued by Neteller,
95% of its revenue was derived from money transfers involving
internet gambling companies. On September 11, 2006, the President
and Chief Executive Officer of Neteller described the "online
gaming market" as Neteller’s "main market," and stated that, in the
first half of 2006, Neteller processed $5.1 billion in financial
transactions. As charged in the complaint, approximately 85% of
Neteller’s revenue during that period derived from individuals in
North America, and 75% of its North American revenue was generated
in the United States. Both the operation of an internet gambling
operation and the transferring of the proceeds from these
businesses overseas are illegal under United States law.
LAWRENCE and LEFEBVRE are both charged with conspiring to
transfer funds with the intent to promote illegal gambling. If
convicted, both defendants face a maximum sentence of 20 years’
imprisonment.
LAWRENCE, 46, was arrested yesterday in the United States
Virgin Islands and will be presented in federal court in St. Thomas
by tomorrow. LEFEBVRE, 55, was arrested yesterday in Malibu,
California and will be presented in Los Angeles federal court later
today. LAWRENCE currently resides in Paradise Island, Bahamas.
Both are Canadian citizens.

-3-
This prosecution is part of the United States Department
of Justice’s effort to combat unlawful internet gambling through,
among other things, the implementation of the federal anti-money
laundering statutes. Other recent examples of the Justice
Department’s efforts in this regard include the indictments of two
offshore internet gambling companies – Worldwide Telesports, Inc.,
(indictment unsealed on May 17, 2006 in the United States District
Court for the District of Columbia) and BetonSports, PLC, a
publicly traded holding company that owns a number of Internet
sportsbooks and casinos, and its founder, Gary Stephen Kaplan
(indictment unsealed July 17, 2006 in the United States District
Court for the Eastern District of Missouri). Additionally, in July
2003, one of Neteller’s competitors, PayPal, and its parent eBay,
entered into a civil settlement agreement with the United States
Attorney’s Office for the Eastern District of Missouri to settle
allegations it aided in illegal offshore and on-line gambling
activities. As part of the agreement, PayPal agreed to forfeit $10
million, representing proceeds derived by PayPal from the
processing of illegal gambling transactions.
Mr. GARCIA praised the investigative efforts of the FBI
and thanked the United States Custom & Border Patrol, United States
Coast Guard, and Virgin Islands Police Department for their
assistance in the investigation. Mr. GARCIA added that the
investigation is continuing.
Mr. GARCIA stated, "Internet gambling has become a
multibillion-dollar industry that derives a major portion of its
revenues from United States citizens. STEPHEN ERIC LAWRENCE and
JOHN DAVID LEFEBVRE knew when they took their company public that
its activities, as well as those of the internet gambling companies
it assisted, were illegal in the United States. Blatant violations
of U.S. law are not a mere ‘risk’ to be disclosed to prospective
investors. Criminal prosecutions related to online gambling will
be pursued even in cases where assets and defendants are positioned
outside of the United States."
FBI Assistant Director MERSHON stated: "Internet gambling
is a multibillion-dollar industry. A significant portion of that
is the illegal handling of Americans' bets with offshore gaming
companies, which amounts to a colossal criminal enterprise
masquerading as legitimate business. There is ample indication
these defendants knew the American market for their services was
illegal. The FBI is adamant about shutting off the flow of illegal
cash."

-4-
Assistant United States Attorneys TIMOTHY J. TREANOR,
CHRISTOPHER P. CONNIFF, and CHRISTINE MEDING are in charge of the
prosecutions.
The charges contained in the Complaints are merely
accusations, and the defendants are presumed innocent unless and
until proven guilty.
07-012 ###
 

Rx. Veteran
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trytrytry said:
Thaks again all you foolish Red states. Sure Glad I dont live in one.

Holy fuck, you're still trying to politicize this?

How's this? If you like to molest children, move to a blue state. Activist judges there go easy on child predators.
 

RX Prophet
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I know this is more about a shakedown and scare tactics than any actual law, but money laundering sounds like a tough case to prove. Non-US citizens open a legal business in a foreign country transferring funds from an International clientèle to other companies operating legally in their respective countries. Even if the "Safe Port" legislation made that illegal anything the two guys arrested would have done would have been "ex post facto".

Of course the US government doesn't need to "prove" anything since enforcing any law is far from the issue here...
 

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